T4 Remote Control Repair/Replacement

[Sandy B]

Some of the buttons on the T4 remote control are becoming spongy and hard to operate. I am considering trying to clean it to see if that will rectify the problem, however I can not see how to open it. Can it be opened and how do you do it.

As an alternative would you recommend a T4 replacement or changing to a Logitech Harmony Universal 350 Remote Control. Is the Harmony hard to setup?

[MrQuade]

As an alternative would you recommend a T4 replacement or changing to a Logitech Harmony Universal 350 Remote Control. Is the Harmony hard to setup?

Can't speak with any authority for opening the T4 remote, but I suspect there are some internal clips that you'd need to be careful about damaging when attempting to open one.
Here is an example of the efforts required to get into a T3 remote.

On the Harmony front, I would suggest that you look at a Harmony 650 instead.
The 350 only has physical buttons, and this can place limits on what operations you can logically program onto them. Many buttons can be loaded with with a short or long press action, but you can end up with a non-intuitive mess if you end up loading up the remote with too many "hidden" commands.
This and the fact that the 350 can only be programmed with a single "activity", so it limits the real power of the Harmony line.

The remotes are pretty easy to program. The MyHarmony software is all menu driven and drag/drop. The biggest trick is just finding where to look for all the features.

[Jan]

As an alternative would you recommend a T4 replacement or changing to a Logitech Harmony Universal 350 Remote Control. Is the Harmony hard to setup?

On the Harmony front, I would suggest that you look at a Harmony 650 instead.

I second that! Love my 650. Have had it for quite a few years (well the model, not the same actual remote), and with the arrival of my V2 I now have 6 devices and 6 activities set up. I was going to delete the Topfield and DP-P1 devices and activities, but thought I would just leave them there in case the V2 ever has a hissy fit and needs to go to Dr Warkus!! Very easy to set up initially, and then just a little bit of time tweaking to get it working exactly how I wanted it. I just hope they don't ever discontinue it!

[Star6key]

...
Love my 650. Have had it for quite a few years (well the model, not the same actual remote),
...

Sadly, that is the issue with the Harmony remotes. They will 'fail' without fail. The innards near the buttons have that craptastic plastic that over time (generally about 18 months) goes sticky and makes the button presses infuriatingly hard, until you need a hammer to make it work.

Logitech will never fix this, as there is no other remote that has anywhere near the functionality, and they know we will just keep buying replacements. I know there is a workaround involving getting a 'kit', but it's too fiddly for my liking.

[Paul_oz53]

...
Love my 650. Have had it for quite a few years (well the model, not the same actual remote),
...

Sadly, that is the issue with the Harmony remotes. They will 'fail' without fail. The innards near the buttons have that craptastic plastic that over time (generally about 18 months) goes sticky and makes the button presses infuriatingly hard, until you need a hammer to make it work.

Logitech will never fix this, as there is no other remote that has anywhere near the functionality, and they know we will just keep buying replacements. I know there is a workaround involving getting a 'kit', but it's too fiddly for my liking.

Have to say that while the repair kit is fiddly, both my 650s are going strong with the kits installed. Took me about half an hour each to repair.

Hardest part was peeling back the protective film and positioning each of the button replacement films.

Definitely doable for anyone with craft skills.

[BigbobOz]

Sadly, that is the issue with the Harmony remotes. They will 'fail' without fail. The innards near the buttons have that craptastic plastic that over time (generally about 18 months) goes sticky and makes the button presses infuriatingly hard, until you need a hammer to make it work.

Logitech will never fix this, as there is no other remote that has anywhere near the functionality, and they know we will just keep buying replacements. I know there is a workaround involving getting a 'kit', but it's too fiddly for my liking.

Yeah, they're rubbish but I can't find an alternative and BW aren't selling replacement remotes anymore. I liked the feel of the OneForAll remote but it can't do some of the commands on the T4 or V2.

I don't need anything fancy, prefer larger tactile buttons, even happy to manually program the damn thing.

[Sandy B]

Thanks all for the replies/comments. I have just ordered a Harmony 650, and for some "fun"I will try to repair the old remote upon the arrival of the new remote.

I was a bit shocked that the Harmony could fail in about 18 months, the original T4 remote has lasted me since I bought the T4, which could be 5 or more years ago.

Again thanks all.

[Grumpy_Geoff]

and BW aren't selling replacement remotes anymore.

They still sell the 'BR-T3' (original T3) remote -
"Replacement Remote control compatible with Beyonwiz T series and U series.

Specifications
Support Models T2, T3, T4 & U4"
https://beyonwiz.com.au/product/beyonwi ... e-control/

Pic - https://beyonwiz.com.au/wp-content/uplo ... 80x480.jpg

[prl]

I prefer the T3 remote to the T4 remote anyway.

And it chews through the batteries less.

[Jan]

Have to say that while the repair kit is fiddly, both my 650s are going strong with the kits installed. Took me about half an hour each to repair.

Hardest part was peeling back the protective film and positioning each of the button replacement films.

Definitely doable for anyone with craft skills.

I only found out about the kits after I purchased my last 650. I might try one next time the buttons fail. I remember with my very first Harmony (can't remember model and long since discontinued), when the buttons stopped responding I pulled it apart and cleaned it up a bit inside with nail polish remover!! That got me a bit of extra life. I hadn't been able to work out how to get the 650 apart until I saw the instructions of how to use the kits!

[Paul_oz53]

For the 650 you need a Phillips 000 to remove 6 screws, 2 are hidden under a glued-in insert top rear. Four in the battery compartment.

Peel the insert out carefully. I used a box cutter blade to ease it out.

Two guitar picks to pop it open along one side starting at the battery end. Repeat on the other side. Three more screws to remove the circuit board.

Clean the oily gunk off and install the sticky bits from the kit.

Reassemble and test.

[stevebow]

Have to say that while the repair kit is fiddly, both my 650s are going strong with the kits installed. Took me about half an hour each to repair.

Hardest part was peeling back the protective film and positioning each of the button replacement films.

Definitely doable for anyone with craft skills.

I repaired my 650 with a kit back in August of last year, buttons are still good as new. Details of this are here for anyone interested:

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=13526

[BigbobOz]

They still sell the 'BR-T3' (original T3) remote -
"Replacement Remote control compatible with Beyonwiz T series and U series.

Specifications
Support Models T2, T3, T4 & U4"
https://beyonwiz.com.au/product/beyonwi ... e-control/

Pic - https://beyonwiz.com.au/wp-content/uplo ... 80x480.jpg

Really? Hmm I'm sure I tried it with my T4 and T2 and it didn't work...it's at my folks now, I'll try it next time I'm there.

Thanks,
Rob

[MrQuade]

Really? Hmm I'm sure I tried it with my T4 and T2 and it didn't work...it's at my folks now, I'll try it next time I'm there.

If your T2 or T4 is set to only hear 0x02f2 remote codes, then it wont work with a T3 remote.

You need to set the T2 and T4 to listen for 0xabcd codes.

[Sandy B]

If your T2 or T4 is set to only hear 0x02f2 remote codes, then it wont work with a T3 remote.

You need to set the T2 and T4 to listen for 0xabcd codes.

I received my 650 and after a few hours of trying to program it I gave up and put it in a draw, I think I must be getting too old for these things. Still using the old T4 remote with some spongy keys, and considering purchasing T3 remote.

1. Does the T3 remote have all the functions/keys of the T4
2. How do you set to listen for Oxabcd codes.

[MrQuade]

1. Does the T3 remote have all the functions/keys of the T4
2. How do you set to listen for Oxabcd codes.

Yes it has all the same functions.

You set the remote control codes through the main menu settings.
MENU->Setup->System->Remote control code setting


Maybe you can post some questions about programming the Harmony in a separate thread and we can get that rubbing for you too. You may just be missing a key bit of info to get that running. They really are quite handy and intuitive once you get them set to to your preference. There is also the matter of understanding the concept of a "device" vs an "activity".

[Sandy B]

Thanks for the advice regarding the remote and coding.

Maybe you can post some questions about programming the Harmony in a separate thread and we can get that rubbing for you too. You may just be missing a key bit of info to get that running. They really are quite handy and intuitive once you get them set to to your preference. There is also the matter of understanding the concept of a "device" vs an "activity"

I will have to give it another try some rainy day where I can spend a few hours. You are correct the concept of a "device" vs an "activity", is/was causing me problem. I was trying to set it up so it would only control the T4, however I could not even achieve a simple switch-on. As I said I must be getting old and frustration come in very quickly.

[raymondjpg]

Anyone thinking of buying a Harmony 650 would probably benefit from doing a search on shopbot. The prices shown range from $68.92 to $132.72.

I'm still plugging along with a Harmony 200, and the keys on that are still functional after about 8-9 years of solid use, but some are definitely getting tired now. I've not seen any repair kit for that, but I have a spare 200 and a 350 somewhere that'll probably keep me going for another 20 years.

[prl]

You are correct the concept of a "device" vs an "activity", is/was causing me problem. I was trying to set it up so it would only control the T4, however I could not even achieve a simple switch-on. As I said I must be getting old and frustration come in very quickly.

A Harmony remote like the 650 should be able to be used as a switchable single-device remote or as an activity-based remote.

In single-device mode the remote only sends the infrared codes for that device; in activity modes, different buttons send IR codes fto different devices, so you can control the A/V system as a whole without changing between devices.

It's most powerful used as an activity-based remote, because it should turn everything on that you need for the activity (and not any more), and allow you to split up the buttons according to which device the action should be done on.

So on our setup, we have a TV, Home Theatre (HT) system with an FM tuner and BR/DVD player and a Beyonwiz T4.

In Watch PVR mode, it turns all three on, sets the TV to receive video from the HT system, but have audio handled by the HT system and sets the HT system to take HDMI video and audio from the Beyonwiz. The buttons are then set so that the VOL+/- and MUTE buttons send codes for the HT system, and the rest of the buttons send codes to the T4.

It has activities for Watch TV (TV and HT system on, TV getting video from its built-in tuners), Watch DVD/BR (TV and HT system on, TV getting video from from the HT BR/DVD player and audio handled by the HT system), Listen to the radio (only HT system on, and getting audio from its built-in FM tuner).

All in the one remote, and the remote is set up for the activity, not a single device.

The main setup problem I had was that some devices didn't have full coverage of all their buttons, so I had to teach the Harmony the necessary buttons, and the Watch PVR mode didn't give access to all the T4 remote buttons, so I had to add some f them to the mode.

I'm 65 (though I was ~12 years younger when I started using our Harmony 785), but I do have the advantage of a career mostly in IT.

[Jan]

You are correct the concept of a "device" vs an "activity", is/was causing me problem. I was trying to set it up so it would only control the T4, however I could not even achieve a simple switch-on. As I said I must be getting old and frustration come in very quickly.

I'm 65 (though I was ~12 years younger when I started using our Harmony 785), but I do have the advantage of a career mostly in IT.

Well I'm in my 70th year, and a girl to boot!! I love my Harmony 650. I have 6 Devices and 6 Activities set up. Since I got my V2 the DP-P1 and Toppy are now redundant, but I have kept their activities on there just in case the V2 has a hissy fit or has to go to see Dr Warkus! I found it very intuitive to set up, with just a bit of tinkering to get it doing exactly what I wanted. So Sandy B, hang in there, take your time and give it another go! But don't feel bad or old about it. My son-in-law actually got me to set up theirs for them. So not an age thing at all. Unlike prl I don't have a career in IT or technology of any sort, but I just love this sort of stuff. When we got the kids their first computer (Commodore 64) around 35 years ago, I was more excited than they were!!!

[prl]

I love my Harmony 650. ... I found it very intuitive to set up, with just a bit of tinkering to get it doing exactly what I wanted.

Our 785 uses the old Java setup app, and while the thing is conceptually fairly straightforward, the app is a horrible thing to use (especially in the dark corners of things like learning codes from the original devices).

[Jan]

Our 785 uses the old Java setup app, and while the thing is conceptually fairly straightforward, the app is a horrible thing to use (especially in the dark corners of things like learning codes from the original devices).

I'm pretty sure my first Harmony was a 785. Was that the one that had it's own charging base? And I think the display was a bit more colourful than the 650 if I recall correctly. When it finally died on me, after many times pulling it apart to clean up the buttons, it was no longer available and so I moved on to the 650. Yes, I remember the setup software was a lot different than the 650.

[Sandy B]

Now all of you are starting to make me feel bad. I am 65 years old male never worked in IT but have been using PC computers for 30+ years.

The reason I only wanted 1 activity was that the T4 through CEC already switches the TV on, witches the sound bar on. The sound bar is connected to the TV via an optical cable. This accounts for 90% of my viewing, the only time I use the TV remote is to switch the TV off. The Apple TV is viewed via the T4's HDMI-in, which is switched on and controlled via it's remote control. DVD's are played via a portable disc drive attached to the T4 via a usd. Sound is controlled via the T4's volume adjustment.

So you can see I really require only a very simple installation, however I will try again sometime.

[Paul_oz53]

At nearly 67 another sexagenariun. Engineering is my thing. The Harmony people really force you to learn about Activities before it becomes usable.

In my case, I let the activity Watch TV turn on everything rather than CEC. Then I added devices. Then I tried it out to find out what worked and what didn't. I quickly found that getting the volume controls right was an exercise in masochism but eventually I mastered the beast. After redesignating the large rocker to control the Wiz volume I got the level of control I desired.

Getting every button on every device right really added to effort required. As prl notes, this is one of the worst tasks to perform on Harmony remotes.

[Sandy B]

At nearly 67 another sexagenariun. Engineering is my thing.

At nearly 66 another sexagenariun, engineering (civil) was my thing.

I quickly found that getting the volume controls right was an exercise in masochism

Masochism is the last thing I need, however I appreciate your advice

[Gully]

Feels like this is getting a bit off topic but at 64 it is making me feel younger!

[raymondjpg]

Getting every button on every device right really added to effort required. As prl notes, this is one of the worst tasks to perform on Harmony remotes.

I quickly found that while my old Harmony 525 would turn on all of my devices, they didn't necessarily do so in the right order (for handshakes) and sometimes the IR beam would not reach one or two of the devices resulting in some devices switching on and some still off. As I recall the on/off switches on most devices were power toggles so when I went to an activity to switch everything off some devices switched off, some switched on. Rather than reducing the number of remote handsets I instead found myself with one extra that was just giving me a headache.

No doubt I could have ironed out the problems by adjusting lines of sight for the IR signals, but instead ended up with a Harmony 200 to control my HTPCs and stuck with supplied remotes for other devices. The Harmony 200 is well and truly obsolete now but it looks like the 350 is still available. While very limited in activity functionality it's enduring advantage for me is much longer battery life because there is no display.

[Jan]

Feels like this is getting a bit off topic but at 64 it is making me feel younger!

Lucky you! I'm feeling like a dinosaur!!!

[MrQuade]

and sometimes the IR beam would not reach one or two of the devices resulting in some devices switching on and some still off.

While the Harmony Elite is very pricey, it was money well spent in my opinion. The IR beam is emitted from a fixed base station, so you can ensure everything is always in the IR line of sight. You can also hold the remote up to your eyes in case you are wanting to engage any less familiar keystrokes. I'd actually bought it originally for the Bluetooth support, but the rest was just gravy.

[Gully]

While the Harmony Elite is very pricey, it was money well spent in my opinion. The IR beam is emitted from a fixed base station, so you can ensure everything is always in the IR line of sight. You can also hold the remote up to your eyes in case you are wanting to engage any less familiar keystrokes. I'd actually bought it originally for the Bluetooth support, but the rest was just gravy.

Totally agree though fortunately I bought mine on special for just under $200.

I've had a few Harmony models over the years and still think they are the best option.

[Star6key]

...
While the Harmony Elite is very pricey, it was money well spent in my opinion.
...

It only has half the buttons of the 650. Ripoff!
Completely useless for me as I use the 650 to control my PC with a HP media center ir receiver. Besides, I like throwing away money every 18 months when I have to replace the 650 because of the dodgy buttons.

[MrQuade]

It only has half the buttons of the 650. Ripoff!
Completely useless for me as I use the 650 to control my PC with a HP media center ir receiver.

The Elite will control your htpc just as easily as any other IR device.

The Elite only lacks the number keypad from the other remotes, and I can honestly say I have never missed the number keys. You can still access the numbers from the LCD touchscreen if they are really needed anyway.

[raymondjpg]

While the Harmony Elite is very pricey, it was money well spent in my opinion. The IR beam is emitted from a fixed base station, so you can ensure everything is always in the IR line of sight. You can also hold the remote up to your eyes in case you are wanting to engage any less familiar keystrokes. I'd actually bought it originally for the Bluetooth support, but the rest was just gravy.

My Scottish gene got in the way of considering this beauty.

Besides, I like throwing away money every 18 months when I have to replace the 650 because of the dodgy buttons.

What if the Elite suffers from the same malady?

Whatever folks, we rely on your purchases of upmarket Harmony remotes to keep Logitech in business., and My Harmony online for reprogramming the cheapos when necessary.

[MrQuade]

What if the Elite suffers from the same malady?

My harmony ultimate has been in service for several years without any sign of problems to date.

The elite is only a couple of years old and also looking fine.

[prl]

The Ellie will control your htpc ...

Is Ellie a friend of Trevor's?

[MrQuade]

Is Ellie a friend of Trevor's?

Must be! He's been keeping her a secret!

[Star6key]

...
Love my 650. Have had it for quite a few years (well the model, not the same actual remote),
...

Sadly, that is the issue with the Harmony remotes. They will 'fail' without fail. The innards near the buttons have that craptastic plastic that over time (generally about 18 months) goes sticky and makes the button presses infuriatingly hard, until you need a hammer to make it work.

Logitech will never fix this, as there is no other remote that has anywhere near the functionality, and they know we will just keep buying replacements. I know there is a workaround involving getting a 'kit', but it's too fiddly for my liking.

Well that didn't take long... another one bites the dust.
It's funny how the colour keys always seem to be the first to go. Having a look at the current prices for the 650... it seems some stores are on crack. JB Hifi, Officeworks and The Good Guys are trying to flog them off for $129
MSY have it at $65, but they only have one in stock in a Vic store... pass. Best I could do is $79 delivered from the logitech store through Amazon.

[MrQuade]

Well that didn't take long... another one bites the dust.
It's funny how the colour keys always seem to be the first to go.

Are you still using them for skipping? I don't think those ones are designed for high duty usage

[Star6key]

Well that didn't take long... another one bites the dust.
It's funny how the colour keys always seem to be the first to go.

Are you still using them for skipping? I don't think those ones are designed for high duty usage

You make it sound as if the internal components are made by expert craftsmen who hand fashion each part for a specific use and have individual tolerances so that they give the user the ultimate ... wait, what... where am I?

Red -1m, Green +3m, Yellow (can't be changed/used for some bizarre reason), Blue +30sec.

[MrQuade]

You make it sound as if the internal components are made by expert craftsmen who hand fashion each part for a specific use and have individual tolerances so that they give the user the ultimate ... wait, what... where am I?

No, but the coloured buttons are itty bitty little things, and the arrow buttons are big and would be less subject to being pushed on an angle. The physical dimensions of the buttons play a big part in how they wear.

[Jan]

Are you still using them for skipping? I don't think those ones are designed for high duty usage

Interesting! I had always used the coloured buttons for skipping on the Toppy, and now I think about it, it probably was those buttons that seemed to fail. Maybe now my 650 will last a bit longer!! Fingers crossed!!