Nine Ice tv information

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omen33
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Nine Ice tv information

Post by omen33 » Sat Aug 15, 2009 22:03

I would like to confirm if Channel 9 is not allowing ice tv to display information. If this is the case am I entitled to a refund for a service that is not being provided by ice tv?

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Paul55
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Post by Paul55 » Sat Aug 15, 2009 22:47

IceTV is allowed to provide channel Nine program data, but only under certain conditions based on collection methodology. There have been no real problems with 9 Digital or 9HD for many months (since IceTV won the right to collect and provide data following a protracted court case).
There has been some delay in compiling the the GO! channel info, but that should be resolved shortly.
You could try complaining to Channel 9, even though they lost the court case (which almost sent the small IceTV company broke) they are still doing their best to impede the IceTV service.
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download
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Re: Nine Ice tv information

Post by download » Sun Aug 16, 2009 19:25

omen33 wrote:I would like to confirm if Channel 9 is not allowing ice tv to display information. If this is the case am I entitled to a refund for a service that is not being provided by ice tv?
Not the case. Nine basically sued ICETV for a few years on copyright issues. 99 out of 100 companies probably would have been buried by such tactics but eventually the high court ruled and basically told Nine where to shove it. So if you get the service you'll note the ch9 epg is all there. Go! will take a few weeks to gt up and running to full speed.

As to the more theoretical question, if ICE couldn't provide 9 then its likely you'd be entitled a refund.

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Re: Nine Ice tv information

Post by Gully » Mon Aug 17, 2009 01:40

download wrote:As to the more theoretical question, if ICE couldn't provide 9 then its likely you'd be entitled a refund.
Even that might not be as black and white as that.

If they couldn't provide the EPG, and I agree that is not the case, your refund might depend on whether you knew that at the time of taking the service.
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IanSav
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Post by IanSav » Mon Aug 17, 2009 12:27

Hi,

Now that the legal case with Nine is settled I don''t know why IceTV doesn't just buy the aggregated TV guide from the Channel 9 subsidiary/related company that produces them (HWW). This is the guide that is used by Foxtel and TiVo.

If HWW won't sell IceTV the guide then I wonder if there is a legal case that IceTV can bring against them? :P

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download
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Post by download » Mon Aug 17, 2009 15:34

Now that the legal case with Nine is settled I don''t know why IceTV doesn't just buy the aggregated TV guide from the Channel 9
IceTV wanted this all along. Channel 9 (and by proxy all the networks) have simply refused. The court case still upheld that Nine owns the copyright to its EPG data, just that ICETV doesn't infringe that copyright. As such there's no onus on Nine to share its version with anyone. If you write a book you can insist that no one can publish it as long as you hold copyright.

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Post by IanSav » Mon Aug 17, 2009 15:47

Hi Peter,
download wrote:
Now that the legal case with Nine is settled I don''t know why IceTV doesn't just buy the aggregated TV guide from the Channel 9
IceTV wanted this all along. Channel 9 (and by proxy all the networks) have simply refused. The court case still upheld that Nine owns the copyright to its EPG data, just that ICETV doesn't infringe that copyright. As such there's no onus on Nine to share its version with anyone. If you write a book you can insist that no one can publish it as long as you hold copyright.
The guide data is available for sale. Certainly HWW can refuse to sell to IceTV but given that they are in the business of selling guide data and the fact that they sell it to Channel 7 and TiVo I think this could be dangerous ground. I would think that IceTV have grounds to take HWW to the appropriate tribunal if they refuse IceTV.

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Post by Paul55 » Mon Aug 17, 2009 15:55

Perhaps they feel they've spent enough time/resources fighting court cases instead of carrying out their core business.
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download
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Post by download » Tue Aug 18, 2009 09:04

IanSav wrote:The guide data is available for sale. Certainly HWW can refuse to sell to IceTV but given that they are in the business of selling guide data and the fact that they sell it to Channel 7 and TiVo I think this could be dangerous ground. I would think that IceTV have grounds to take HWW to the appropriate tribunal if they refuse IceTV.
I don't believe there is an appropriate tribunal in this instance. You're thinking of something like anti competitive behavior. I don't think this applies to intellectual property. Could be wrong though.

Regardless, HNW would sell to ICETV if they agreed to abide by the same restrictions all other buyers need to - namely the EPG would not be used on a device that facilitates ad skipping etc.

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Post by prl » Tue Aug 18, 2009 09:40

download wrote:
IanSav wrote:The guide data is available for sale. Certainly HWW can refuse to sell to IceTV but given that they are in the business of selling guide data and the fact that they sell it to Channel 7 and TiVo I think this could be dangerous ground. I would think that IceTV have grounds to take HWW to the appropriate tribunal if they refuse IceTV.
I don't believe there is an appropriate tribunal in this instance. You're thinking of something like anti competitive behavior. I don't think this applies to intellectual property. Could be wrong though.
...
Isn't the ACCC the "appropriate tribunal" for anti-competitive behaviour? I also have no idea whether that HWW does/did with its licensing is covered by that, though.
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Post by Yanis » Thu Aug 27, 2009 17:16

download wrote: The court case still upheld that Nine owns the copyright to its EPG data, just that ICETV doesn't infringe that copyright. As such there's no onus on Nine to share its version with anyone. If you write a book you can insist that no one can publish it as long as you hold copyright.

Regards

Peter Gillespie
Incorrect. It is all in the judgement which can be obtained through a simple google.

Because both parties conceded the copyright the court was only asked to rule on fair use which it did. It did not rule on copyright however mention was made in the judgement of the issue of copyright. It talked at length about what constituted copyright and why this information may be thought subject to copyright. It went on to say that raw information could not be subject to copyright and in the discussion implied that the information used by IceTV in compiling its guide was probably not subject to copyright.

It left the way open for a future ruling on the matter. The bottom line is that it is unlikely that a future case claiming copyright to such information would succeed.

The court also discussed the difference between the EPG information and such things as books of oroginal work.

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