V2 locks up and misses recordings

[nexus7]

My six week old V2 is behaving very unpredictably.
It will occasionally lock up - no response from remote. Solution is to reboot.
It will miss 'some' scheduled recordings - either nothing on the recording list or "0 mins" shown on recording list.
Usually 1 or 2 lockups or missed recordings each day.
Perhaps I have only 1 or 2 tuners working. I should have 3 - - 2 in the V2 and one 'blue' one plugged into one of USB ports.
My reception is very good. The picture on the TV is fantastic. No weak signals.
Any help towards diagnosing the problem will be much appreciated.

[MrQuade]

Definitely not normal.

During the lockup, does it happen while you are using it, or just when it is in standby?
If while using, does live TV continue to play?
If while in standby, does it come out of standby? (Front button press)

What firmware revision is it running?

What else is plugged into the V2? USB drive, SD card, USB hub, what type of tuner do you have?

Any plugins installed?

I am thinking it might just be worth installing a fresh copy of the latest firmware from USB.
viewtopic.php?f=45&t=14964

[nexus7]

Thank you for your prompt comments. Answers as follows:-
- Lockups occur whilst watching live TV, during playback of recordings, and during recording only.
TV does not continue to play after lockup (black screen)
No, it won't come out of lockup or respond to any remote commands, except after a reboot.
Firmware is 19.3 build 2021 10 10
Only the 1 TB HD and the 'blue' single tuner (both as supplied by Beyonwiz) are connected to the V2
I have not installed any plugins. Ice TV was already installed, which I use a lot.
I hope this helps
Regards
Mike

[MrQuade]

Thank you for your prompt comments. Answers as follows:-
- Lockups occur whilst watching live TV, during playback of recordings, and during recording only.
TV does not continue to play after lockup (black screen)
No, it won't come out of lockup or respond to any remote commands, except after a reboot.

Thanks for that. However, that is an odd type of failure, and maybe hints at a hardware fault.

One question I thought of, but forgot to post, was whether the V2 is networked, and if its web interface was still responsive when in this state.
The fact that you say you are getting failed recordings would suggest to me that the V2 would also be unresponsive to the network too.

If it is responsive to the network, then the lockup might possibly be just a loss of HDMI sync, causing the TV screen to blank out. But as before, that sort of failure wouldn't cause recordings to fail, unless any frantic remote control button presses and power cycle are maybe interfering.

Firmware is 19.3 build 2021 10 10

Nice and up to date, good to have!

Only the 1 TB HD and the 'blue' single tuner (both as supplied by Beyonwiz) are connected to the V2
I have not installed any plugins. Ice TV was already installed, which I use a lot.

So pretty standard there too.
Was the harddisk formatted by the v2 in ext4 format? Or is it in a factory-set NTFS format? Not that it should be causing this sort of black-screen behaviour, even if it is in the non-preferred format.

I hope this helps

Yep, great responses

Re-loading the firmware from USB is unlikely to help if this is a hardware fault. It might be worth trying, just in case though.

Seeing as the USB tuner isn't showing up, you might want to try running the V2 with that unplugged for a bit.
I suspect that the latest firmware is causing the shorter USB tuners to malfunction....I recall there was a somewhat recent thread discussing these. I think the taller "Bluey" tuners are ok, and the Hauppauge tuners still work (unless you buy a recent model that is configured for "bulk" mode.......geez, when did this all get so complicated).

Another possibility is a faulty power supply brick. If the v2 is power starved, it may end up misbehaving in any number on unintended ways. If you have a compatible power supply, it might be worth a shot.

[Grumpy_Geoff]

Only the 1 TB HD and the 'blue' single tuner (both as supplied by Beyonwiz) are connected to the V2
I have not installed any plugins. Ice TV was already installed, which I use a lot.

Seeing as the USB tuner isn't showing up, you might want to try running the V2 with that unplugged for a bit.
I suspect that the latest firmware is causing the shorter USB tuners to malfunction....I recall there was a somewhat recent thread discussing these. I think the taller "Bluey" tuners are ok, ...

Mike's got a bluey, 1st post and the quoted reply both identify a "blue" USB tuner. I don't think Beyonwiz have supplied the "MinI' for quite a while.
I don't think it was shown that the USB tuner isn't being detected.

[nexus7]

Thank you Mr Q and Grumpy.
Just confirming that all 3 tuners are detected as shown in 'settings'.
It has not misbehaved for 24 hours, so I'm not sure where to go from here.
Regards
Mike

[nexus7]

Sorry, I forgot to add the V2 is formatted by the V2 as recommended.
Regards
Mike

[nexus7]

I have decided that my unit must have a hardware fault, so I have tried to contact Beyonwiz by email. But so far, one week later, I have had no response.
Does anyone know of a telephone number for Beyonwiz?
Regards
Mike

[Grumpy_Geoff]

But so far, one week later, I have had no response.

Submit a support request - https://dtcsupport.zendesk.com/hc/en-gb/requests/new

[mkwilson]

I have decided that my unit must have a hardware fault, so I have tried to contact Beyonwiz by email. But so far, one week later, I have had no response.
Does anyone know of a telephone number for Beyonwiz?
Regards
Mike

Well the Beyonwiz shop FAQ still carries the following notice, but I'm not sure you'll get much joy:

"We do not currently sell via any retail channels, by selling direct to you we find that we can better support our users and in the rare event that anything goes wrong we can act immediately by giving you expert advice and quick solutions. We have one low Australia wide shipping cost of $15 and this is fully insured and traceable.

You can view some videos –Click Here– so you will get an idea of how the user interface works. Also feel free to give us a call if you have any questions before you buy on (02)96031822."

https://beyonwiz.com.au/faqs/#155363698 ... c9792-1b60

the references to acting immediately are somewhat ironic, and not in an Alanis Morrisette sense.

[nexus7]

Thank you Grumpy and MK. I've left a phone message and submitted a support request.
Regards
Mike

[Hati]

I am having the same random lockup issues with my (much older) V2.

I thought that it is power related issue, because my better half noticed that turning off (or on, can't remember) a bank of LED lights in the house caused a lockup.

So, off I went to Jaycar for a replacement power supply and got this: https://www.jaycar.com.au/12v-dc-5a-des ... g/p/MP3242 on recommendation from the sales person when I asked for a very well filtered power supply. This pack is twice the capacity of the original adaptor, so I believe there is more than enough capacity to discard any power starvation induced lockup.

Lockups however keep happening. Way less frequently than before, but unfortunately I am unable to narrow down the circumstances further.

Start to think that I have multiple reasons for these lockups and the new brick only removed the power spike related ones.

@nexus7: did you get any luck with response from BW?

[sub3R]

... my better half noticed that turning off (or on, can't remember) a bank of LED lights in the house caused a lockup.
...
Lockups however keep happening. Way less frequently than before, but unfortunately I am unable to narrow down the circumstances further.

If I was fault finding this, I would first see if I got any lockups when these LEDs in the house weren’t being switched either on or off or were on. If I didn’t then I would suspect these LEDs or something in the circuit as being the problem.

The V2 may not have anything wrong with it. Poor quality LEDs or failing LEDs can cause interference that can upset electronic devices.

[sub3R]

In addition to what I mentioned in my previous post, make sure your antenna connections are in good condition. That is, good clean tight connections from the antenna wall socket through to the V2. If the lockups are being caused by electrical interference, it can get into the V2 via the antenna cabling.

[Hati]

If I was fault finding this, I would first see if I got any lockups when these LEDs in the house weren’t being switched either on or off or were on. If I didn’t then I would suspect these LEDs or something in the circuit as being the problem.

The V2 may not have anything wrong with it. Poor quality LEDs or failing LEDs can cause interference that can upset electronic devices.

She only caught the lockup timing to coincide with switching on the lights once. Wasn't happening frequently enough to take note of the circumstances. Having said that, you can see a little hesitation like pause, maybe half a second or so, when lights are repeatedly switched within a second on-off. These are quality LED globes but run off iron core transformers.

From my experience dried out caps in power supplies are often the culprit due to reduced filtering. Hence I started with a new power supply. I had it replaced a week ago and the box locked up only once or twice at the most since.

In addition to what I mentioned in my previous post, make sure your antenna connections are in good condition. That is, good clean tight connections from the antenna wall socket through to the V2. If the lockups are being caused by electrical interference, it can get into the V2 via the antenna cabling.

The antenna connections are all crimp-on and the cabling is RG6, but I do have a section of the old air gap coax from the antenna into the roof space. Also, all the splitter connections are screw-in/crimp-on connectors. I used to install Foxtel in another life, so this part is definitely not an issue.

Been a while since I looked, but does the V2 have any power distribution/filtering section in the box or does it rely completely on the power pack to filter out the AC noises? Just looking for any caps potentially dried out.

[sub3R]

It sounds like you have the antenna coax & connectors pretty well covered, unless that piece of old antenna coax is run parallel close to the same 240V circuit those house LED lights are on.

I notice the power supply you purchased has a ferrite beads on the 12V output cable – perhaps try a clamp type one on the power supply 240V input cable.

We don’t have any ceiling LED lights in our home but I don’t think you should get that “little hesitation like pause” when switching the LEDs on/off. This indicates to me that some rubbish is somehow getting into the V2.

For the process of elimination try removing any external USB tuners. On our U4 I had some USB cables connecting the ‘bluey’ USB tuner to the U4 cause strange things to happen with the U4. While this didn’t cause the U4 to hang it does show that our U4 is picky about certain things.

Clutching at straws, & as strange as this may seem for your problem, but have you tried a USB f/w re-install? I’ve found that on both our U4s the firmware can become corrupted which can cause strange things to happen. One example was when the U4 would randomly wake up from deep standby for no apparent reason. This was rectified by a USB firmware re-install with restore settings. Another example is whenever we get a 240V power supply outage, & if one of the U4s is on or in standby, I can guarantee I will get corruption that causes the client U4 from seeing files on the server U4 over the wired LAN. A USB f/w re-install with restore settings is the only way to rectify this.

I can’t help with the question about the filtering on the power supply side of the V2, I don’t have any experience with a V2. I know what you mean about the caps, and Beyonwiz aren’t noted for using good quality caps. Unfortunately it isn’t just Beyonwiz, I get disappointed when I open up a well respected brand device & find low quality electros fitted.

[Paul_oz53]

Regarding internal filtering in the V2, I don't know for sure but it would be highly likely the power brick input goes to a number of internal regulators to produce lower voltages used locally on the motherboard.

[Hati]

Thanks Gents, I think the USB suggestion behind the box was the winner.

I have a powered USB 3 hub that has two dual USB tuners plugged in plus the HDD in the second USB port. Touching something there resulted in a lockup, so safe to say that the lighting induced spikes are not the cause of my troubles. Looked like that the antenna connections to the USB tuners were touchy to touch (intended pun). Reorganised them a bit and all is well again.

Thank goodness for that as I already started the research to replace the V2 and the options are very limited...

[sub3R]

That’s good news, let’s hope that was the problem.

In regards to your touchy antenna connections, the following may help. For any push in connections (for example the Belling-Lee PAL type antenna connections); with the aid of long nose pliers & a small flat blade screwdriver I adjust (squeeze & or spread depending which contact) the outside shield contact & the centre contact so they fit their opposite contacts firmly to give a good connection. I then thoroughly clean all mating surfaces with 100% Isopropyl Alcohol. With very low current & voltage it doesn’t take much to give a poor connection.

[Hati]

That’s good news, let’s hope that was the problem.

In regards to your touchy antenna connections, the following may help. For any push in connections (for example the Belling-Lee PAL type antenna connections); with the aid of long nose pliers & a small flat blade screwdriver I adjust (squeeze & or spread depending which contact) the outside shield contact & the centre contact so they fit their opposite contacts firmly to give a good connection. I then thoroughly clean all mating surfaces with 100% Isopropyl Alcohol. With very low current & voltage it doesn’t take much to give a poor connection.

I got everything crossed

I'll keep the antenna connection tricks in mind as the system is rock solid for now. If it plays up again, I'll go through those connections next.

[nexus7]

Hi Hati

@nexus7: did you get any luck with response from BW?
No Hati, no response yet from Beyonwiz. It has been some weeks now.
I'm thinking that I have just lost $480.00 - but I will keep trying to contact them
Mike

[Blot]

Try setting C or D as the default tuner and see if you get a picture.

[nexus7]

Hi Blot. Setting C as 'preferred' tuner gives a picture. Same as setting A or B.
I have set both 'recording tuner' and 'live TV' tuner to 'auto'.
This has helped a little. However, I am still missing recordings - they show up on the recorded list as '0 minutes' in duration.

[Grumpy_Geoff]

However, I am still missing recordings - they show up on the recorded list as '0 minutes' in duration.

For some recordings or all recordings?
If you press i/INFO on the relevant timers for those empty recordings, do they all use the same tuner?

[Blot]

You might need a Kingray. The duel ones come up on ebay for $30 sometimes. The quads are $100 or so, but probably unnecessary.

The more expensive option is to call mrantena and they will come a tell you you need a new antenna. New antennas in Melbourne pick up 2 and 10 better.

Use tuner C and see what the signal says when u push “ok” on the remote. I am not sure how accurate that info is for addon tuners though.

[Blot]

Check the signal for all channels especially ABC hd.

Also I get a 7% better signal from coax with F-Type connectors. And another 8% boost from the Kingray. The PAL tv cables are generally crap unless you get a special magical one.

[Paul_oz53]

You might need a Kingray. The duel ones come up on ebay for $30 sometimes. The quads are $100 or so, but probably unnecessary.

The more expensive option is to call mrantena and they will come a tell you you need a new antenna. New antennas in Melbourne pick up 2 and 10 better.

Use tuner C and see what the signal says when u push “ok” on the remote. I am not sure how accurate that info is for addon tuners though.

Highly likely - the Wizzes I have at home or installed for others all needed a signal booster to work acceptably.

[Blot]

Mine work ok without the Kingray but I got another Kingray today in the mail from ebay cheap. I had a Kingray years ago but I must have given it to a friend.

Hopefully the Kingray will stop the occasional static I get, (once a week or so I get 1/4 second of static. ) Not much but I got one anyway. It protects your gear from lightning as a bonus.

The white pal cable left is crap. The coax f-type blue is what u need.

[Blot]

The DVB-T2 tuners A and B don’t need help as they are probably more efficient. The PlayTV DVB-T tuners C and D through the pass through do need a little help probably.

I could not find any dual DVB-T2 tuners on ebay to test on the pass through.

[Blot]

I am not sure if the info on the pass through C and D is correct, as I have always got Quality 0% for my PlayTV tuners. The signal on C and D for ABC is 42% with f-type and Kingray. On A B 58% and the tv’s tuner (PAL cable) is 100% although the PAL cable is much worse on the PlayTV than the coax (I think it is called coax cable, not sure).

[MrQuade]

Remember that the percentages are not a reliable indication to compare one tuner with another one.
What the percentages are useful for is determining if the signal improves or degrades when you change the antenna/signal conditions of that tuner.

eg. "When I switch from pass through to direct-to-antenna, the percentage improves"

There is a lot of black magic that goes into condensing the signal characteristics and how they interact with the tuner hardware into a simple numerical percentage, and the black magic is different in most cases, so the tuner drivers come up with different results.

(The 0% readings are just flat out driver/hardware bugs which should be fixable in theory)

[Gully]

You might need a Kingray. The duel ones come up on ebay for $30 sometimes. The quads are $100 or so, but probably unnecessary.

In case you do need a quad splitter you can get them for $75 from ebay, Selby or Radio Parts currently.

[nexus7]

It is now about three months since I bought my V2 - Faulty from new.
Calls, emails etc to Beyonwiz have gone unanswered.
I suspect the worst. Has anyone heard from them recently? or have they closed up shop?

[nexus7]

As I cannot get my faulty V2 replaced by Beyonwiz, I hope to try a workaround.

The V2 cannot reliably receive programs, but my T4 works well, except that it will not reliably talk to my new Samsung 'smart' TV (drop-outs every few minutes). The V2 however, talks nicely to the TV.

Will this work? - send all recordings directly from the T4 to the V2 (via USB and a USB hub) to the V2 Hard Disc. Then use the V2 for all playback.

Or do I need a NAS?

Regards Mike

[prl]

Will this work? - send all recordings directly from the T4 to the V2 (via USB and a USB hub) to the V2 Hard Disc.

Do you mean to connect the V2's USB HDD to the T4, manually copy the recordings, and then connect the HDD back to the V2?

That will work, but I'm not sure how long it will take for you to get fed up with doing it.

[nexus7]

Sorry Peter, I meant to say 'connect the T4 to the V2 hard disc permanently, and also leave the V2 hard disc plugged in to the V2'. That would give the T4 and the V2 access to the hard disc all the time.

[Paul_oz53]

...

The V2 cannot reliably receive programs, but my T4 works well, except that it will not reliably talk to my new Samsung 'smart' TV (drop-outs every few minutes). The V2 however, talks nicely to the TV.

...

Regards Mike

Can you clarify this? In particular, have you disabled enhanced mode on the Samsung HDMI port if its on? My T3 can't deliver sound if enhanced mode is on on the HDMI port.

My interest is we're going to buy an 80+ inch TV, probably a Samsung, after we move Wednesday this week. Definitely want it to work with the T4 and U4. Not convinced I will really value OLED over QLED but would swap brands if Samsung is problematic. We'll also get a mid to high-end soundbar too. Maybe the Samsung 5.1.2ch Dolby Atmos Soundbar or better. (Off topic: Alternative suggestions welcome up to $5,000 - $6,000 all up.)

[Grumpy_Geoff]

Will this work? - send all recordings directly from the T4 to the V2 (via USB and a USB hub) to the V2 Hard Disc. Then use the V2 for all playback.

You can "mount" the T4's "Movie" share on the V2.
Then to play the T4's recordings through the V2 to the TV, open the media selection list on the V2, press YELLOW/Locations and select the T4's Movie share.

You can also mount the V2's "Movie" share on the T4. Then you can set timers with that share as the recording location.

Both methods require the T4 and V2 to be connected to your home network.

[prl]

Sorry Peter, I meant to say 'connect the T4 to the V2 hard disc permanently, and also leave the V2 hard disc plugged in to the V2'. That would give the T4 and the V2 access to the hard disc all the time.

I don't think you can do that with a USB hub. Certainly not with one I've met before.

[raymondjpg]

Not convinced I will really value OLED over QLED but would swap brands if Samsung is problematic.

I ran a Samsung QN90A for nine months or so and was happy with its performance, mostly used for home theatre SDR video playback and live TV via Kodi, also a U4 occasionally, particularly as the picture quality of the neo QLED was much more vibrant than UHD LED Samsungs and Sonys I have had previously.

For the past two weeks I have been coming to grips with an LG C2 OLED evo and have found that my expectations of what looks good and what doesn't have had to be revised quite radically. Largely because blacks are blacker and it becomes more difficult to configure for shadow detail.

I'll persist, and anticipate that I will eventually warm to the new look, but I'd be wary of recommending an OLED over a QLED for predominantly SDR video playback and viewing, particularly if cost is an issue.

I don't much like the character of HEVC compared with AVC, but if I were to be using the TV more for HDR then I might have a different view.

I wouldn't think that a Samsung QLED would be problematic for a T4 and U4 if enhanced mode on the HDMI ports were disabled. However I did read somewhere that Samsung might be walking away from neo QLED towards OLED technology, I suspect because they don't like it being compared unfavourably with OLED. This because there has been more of a shift towards using TVs as monitors for gaming consoles and PCs where shadow detail probably doesn't matter so much.

[Paul_oz53]

Thanks Raymondjpg,

I have watched a few videos by a calibration expert who considered Samsung and Sony to be high quality out of the box and OLED to be superior quality but by a small margin.

I recall him mentioning getting OLED shadow details right to be particularly challenging on some TVs. Apparently there can be complex interactions between the preset modes and the advanced settings.

When we settle in the shopping will start!

Cheers. Paul

[raymondjpg]

Thanks Raymondjpg,

I have watched a few videos by a calibration expert who considered Samsung and Sony to be high quality out of the box and OLED to be superior quality but by a small margin.

I recall him mentioning getting OLED shadow details right to be particularly challenging on some TVs. Apparently there can be complex interactions between the preset modes and the advanced settings.

When we settle in the shopping will start!

Cheers. Paul

I should have added that QLED (and particularly neo QLED) would win hands down in any competition between QLED and OLED for daytime viewing. From what I have read, brighter OLED TVs come in the "rather too expensive for me" territory.

[Paul_oz53]

I should have added that QLED (and particularly neo QLED) would win hands down in any competition between QLED and OLED for daytime viewing. From what I have read, brighter OLED TVs come in the "rather too expensive for me" territory.

That was also clear in the side by side comparisons I watched. I also saw a very interesting projector review but was warned that it wasn't recommended for rooms with lots of windows. QLED is probably where we'll end up.

Like you, the really good stuff is way too pricey for me.

[MrQuade]

Q-OLED is where things are heading in the short term.

This technology uses a single colour OLED array to provide the light on a per-pixel level like normal OLED, but then uses the "Q" quantum dots to filter the light and losslessly produce the colour.

You get increased brightness over an OLED, but you still get the true blacks.

I think the near-black performance is still being improved, since LEDs and OLEDs still have a minimum level of illumination they can produce.

Beyond that, there seems to be work going into shrinking the size of conventional LEDs which could mitigate the durability issues that OLED has.

QLED displays will fall by the wayside as the limitations of LCDs have been reached.

I for one will never return to a LCD based display after having owned OLED.
I also appreciate that LG are one of the only manufacturers that are making their own HDMI circuitry, so they have been market leaders in achieving proper all-ports support for the latest HDMI standards. Other manufacturers either don't fully support the standard or can only do so on a limited subset of their inputs. They are catching up now though finally.
AV receiver manufacturers are lagging even further behind TV manufacturers.

[raymondjpg]

Q-OLED is where things are heading in the short term.

Samsung's QD-OLED TV, the QS95B, just pips LG's C2 in the latest rtings assessments at https://www.rtings.com/tv/learn/qled-vs-oled-vs-led.

It, like the equivalent Sony offering, was not ready to market in Australia when I acquired a C2, but I would have been sorely tempted to try a 55" one if it had weighed in three or four kilograms lighter, important for my (essential) TV bracket. The 55" C2 was within specs for that, and Samsung do not currently manufacture a QS95B with a smaller screen size.

This CNET article https://www.cnet.com/tech/home-entertai ... ial-sauce/ makes the point that side-by-side comparison with the C2 would be useful, and the rtings table give some such information in the reviews available for each with a mouse click.

[MrQuade]

Samsung's QD-OLED TV

Yep sorry, that's what I was referring to when I used the Q-OLED term.

I don't know who else other than Sony and Samsung is doing QD-OLED in the TV market, but Dell had released at least one monitor model. There may have been one of the B-tier manufacturers too.....

Enough to say that QLED, OLED, and QD-OLED are all entirely different things , and I think that QD-OLED is the best option for right now, or tomorrow (supplies permitting!). For next xxx year....bets are off!!