Kicking the Tyres on a V2

[panda]

Hi all

I've been a HTPC user with Windows Media Center ince windows XP (currently stuck on Windows 8.1), microsoft have announced discontinued support of the EPG from January 2020, and my pc is long in the tooth, so here I am.

I have a few questions before deciding on a V2 please:

1. Will the system work without an internet connection for FTA TV and recording, scheduling? or does the guide rely on a Beyonwiz source?
2. Does any functinality rely on Beyonwiz servers? (just want to know I can still use if Beyonwiz ceases to exist in 12months time)?
2. Just checking the HDD in the V2 is internal? if so, is it 2.5" or 3.5"?
3. With 2 Tuners does that mean you can record up to 8 shows concurrently but only on two networks (say ABC2, ABC3, SBS and SBS3)?
4. What is the warranty duration?

Thanks!

[prl]

1. Will the system work without an internet connection for FTA TV and recording, scheduling? or does the guide rely on a Beyonwiz source?

Operation does not rely on any Beyonwiz sources. You have the option to use the IceTV EPG and recordings management system on it if you want (subscription, $8/month).

2. Does any functinality rely on Beyonwiz servers? (just want to know I can still use if Beyonwiz ceases to exist in 12months time)?

Online firmware updates rely on servers, but AFAIK, they're not actually owned or operated by Beyonwiz. Full firmware updates ("USB updates") are distributed here on the Beyonwiz forum and from the Beyonwiz Web site.

2. Just checking the HDD in the V2 is internal? if so, is it 2.5" or 3.5"?

External. It has 1 rear USB3 port and 1 rear USB2 port.

Whatever HDD physical format you want, though because the USB3 port has enough power supply capacity to power 2.5" USB compact drives, they may be more convenient.

You can also use a microSD card for recordings.

3. With 2 Tuners does that mean you can record up to 8 shows concurrently but only on two networks (say ABC2, ABC3, SBS and SBS3)?

Correct. You can add a USB dual tuner to take it to 4 tuners: up to 8 simultaneous recordings from up to 4 broadcasters.

4. What is the warranty duration?

12 months. But, of course, nothing in that warranty can limit your rights under the Australian Consumer Guarantee, which has no specific time limit.

[Paul_oz53]

12 months. But, of course, nothing in that warranty can limit your rights under the Australian Consumer Guarantee, which has no specific time limit.

Technically, the Australian Consumer Law, which requires that goods be fit for their intended purpose, amongst other criteria.

The effect is that a consumer can reasonably expect some goods to last longer than 12 months in normal use. But, for most electronic goods, failure after an initial burn-in period is unlikely. A design defect affecting multiple users would qualify as making a product not fit for its intended use.

The downside is that how much longer is not defined and is open to debate. For electronic goods, 2 years to 5 years is probably the range that a consumer could credibly argue.

My employer regularly prosecutes persons who try to sidestep the ACL.

[prl]

12 months. But, of course, nothing in that warranty can limit your rights under the Australian Consumer Guarantee, which has no specific time limit.

Technically, the Australian Consumer Law, which requires that goods be fit for their intended purpose, amongst other criteria.

The ACCC talks about "consumer guarantees in the Australian Consumer Law". There's more to Australian Consumer Law than consumer guarantees. But I agree, they don't appear to use the term "Australian Consumer Guarantee". The section of the Australian Consumer Law (Schedule 2 of Competition and Consumer Act 2010) that deals with consumer guarantees is "Consumer guarantees". Hence, I guess, the ACCC terminology.

Getting back on topic, though, the ACCC Web site has "Guidance on the consumer guarantee as to acceptable quality and ‘durability’ " which is aimed at businesses, but provides some possibly useful examples of how it is intended to operate.

There's one more-or-less pertinent example in the ACCC document:

Li Wei buys a basic laptop which comes with a one year manufacturers’ warranty. The laptop’s central processing unit and battery stop working one year and six months after purchase. It is likely Li Wei could claim the laptop is not of acceptable quality under the ACL because it is not reasonably durable. This is because a reasonable consumer would expect a laptop to last for longer than one and a half years, despite the manufacturer’s warranty having expired.

[Paul_oz53]

Getting back on topic, though, the ACCC Web site has "Guidance on the consumer guarantee as to acceptable quality and ‘durability’ " which is aimed at businesses, but provides some possibly useful examples of how it is intended to operate.

There's one more-or-less pertinent example in the ACCC document:

Li Wei buys a basic laptop which comes with a one year manufacturers’ warranty. The laptop’s central processing unit and battery stop working one year and six months after purchase. It is likely Li Wei could claim the laptop is not of acceptable quality under the ACL because it is not reasonably durable. This is because a reasonable consumer would expect a laptop to last for longer than one and a half years, despite the manufacturer’s warranty having expired.

A topic that invites endless discussion and some degree of exaggerated expectations in some more unreasonable consumers.

It was a former colleague of mine that developed and introduced the Act and she lectured us endlessly on pedantic details of the drafting. Nonetheless, as you say, it is the real-world examples that illustrate how the ACL might be applied. The example you quote reflects the point I was making: after the expiry of the manufacturer's warranty there may be a longer implicit warranty period if a reasonable person rationally expected something would last longer. This largely depends on case-by-case studies.

[panda]

1. Will the system work without an internet connection for FTA TV and recording, scheduling? or does the guide rely on a Beyonwiz source?

Operation does not rely on any Beyonwiz sources. You have the option to use the IceTV EPG and recordings management system on it if you want (subscription, $8/month).

I’m not really technical on such things sorry, do I need an icetv subscription for the EPG and series recording or can I get it from another source? (Free)

[peteru]

The broadcasters send EPG together with the TV signal for free. It works very well with the Beyonwiz. IMNSHO the free to air EPG is superior to what IceTV provide. You do not require IceTV to get EPG.

You also do not require an Internet connection (or Beyonwiz servers to be up and running), to get full out-of-the-box functionality.

In other words, the Beyonwiz is fully functional without any ongoing reliance on 3rd parties. It's not like the TiVo, which stopped working properly when the company decided to shut it down.

[Paul_oz53]

The broadcasters send EPG together with the TV signal for free. It works very well with the Beyonwiz. IMNSHO the free to air EPG is superior to what IceTV provide. You do not require IceTV to get EPG.
...

FWIW, I agree the FTA guide is superior to IceTV.

I use IceTV and am unlikely to change as I find it easier to use IceTV to automatically record my favourite programs than autotimers. However, others have mastered autotimers and see no need for IceTV.

Comes down to personal preference: if you only record occasionally and manually switch channels regularly, you can use it straight out of the box.

If you want the EPG to always be up to date then you can use IceTV or a free plugin - EPGRefresh - to do that. If you want the wiz to automatically record programs then autotimers or IceTV are the choices.

If, while you're out, you suddenly realise that you forgot to set a timer IceTV is the easiest way to get a timer started. The technically inclined can use VPNs to do the same thing but that's above my pay grade.

[raymondjpg]

FWIW, I agree the FTA guide is superior to IceTV.

I use IceTV and am unlikely to change as I find it easier to use IceTV to automatically record my favourite programs than autotimers. However, others have mastered autotimers and see no need for IceTV.

Without wanting to split hairs, I don't think that the FTA guide is superior to IceTV, rather they both have their upsides and downsides.

The major advantage of the FTA guide is greater precision of start and end times of programs, although not always when for example a reality show eviction or cricket run overtime. The FTA guide does however need manual updating as auto EPG refresh only runs once a day. For me, an EPG refresh at 6.30 pm covers most of what I want to see updated for evening recordings.

The major advantage of the IceTV EPG is flagging of program repeats, although that relies on both the expertise of the IceTV staff and users who bring errors to the attention of staff. The EPG is updated every 15 minutes. Timers can also be set remotely.

I am in the fortunate position of having a T2 and a U4, so use IceTV on one and FTA EPG and autotimers on the other. Setting aside the issue of cost, if I were forced to decide which option to go for I would choose IceTV. One can always switch between IceTV and the FTA EPG if one wishes to do so for any reason.

[Paul_oz53]

Without wanting to split hairs, I don't think that the FTA guide is superior to IceTV, rather they both have their upsides and downsides.
...

Agree completely - neither is perfect and in normal use there's little difference. I turn on the EIT Now/Next setting to create a bit of a hybrid. Improves late program change information by a small margin.

As you illustrated so clearly, both ways work.

[panda]

Sorry, another question

With the FTA guide can I use keyword search in the program title and description to automatically record shows?

Say I wanted “Top Gear”, can it record all shows with Top Gear in the guide, e.g “Top Gear : Series Return”
Or “Attenborough” to record any show that mentions David Attenborough in the show description?

Also what are the options when the HDD is full?
Stop recording, or delete oldest?

Finally with a USB hub can you have multiple HDD attached?

[MrQuade]

With the FTA guide can I use keyword search in the program title and description to automatically record shows?

You can use any guide to create keyword based recordings. The feature is called "Autotimers". They will work for FTA, or IceTV data, or any other guide data you may import from other sources.

Also what are the options when the HDD is full?
Stop recording, or delete oldest?

It will attempt to empty your trash directory to make space first, but past that measure, it will simply fill up the HDD and stop recording.

There is no baked in auto deletion feature though there are some scripts that you can craft that can perform similar tasks in limited ways.

Finally with a USB hub can you have multiple HDD attached?

Sure. Make sure you are using a powered hub though.

[prl]

Finally with a USB hub can you have multiple HDD attached?

Sure. Make sure you are using a powered hub though.

Sure-ish. There are issues with which USB device gets assigned to /media/hdd, and with there being doubts in general about the order that the devices are associated with mount point names.

[panda]

Really appreciate all your feedback and answers
It’s really helped a lot!