Picture breaking up

[Videonut]

When playing back some video files recently I have noticed the picture breaking up quite frequently. I note that in the bottom right hand corner of the screen that the signal strength sometimes gets as low as 45%. This seems to be much lower than what I recall being normal. Is this likely to be the problem and if so what would be considered being the lowest acceptable figure?



I have also seen the spicky wheel several time recently is this likely to be from the same problem?

THanks in advance

[Paul_oz53]

You ask a tricky question: there is not a simple clear answer. Ideally, you want at least 85% for both strength and quality. But I got good reception on lower levels before I upgraded. If it works ok at lower levels then, for you, that's the threshold.

What matters is a sudden change from the norm. Usually this will suggest an aerial or aerial wiring problem. Broken elements will be obvious. Corroded or loose connections are much harder to identify.

Maybe a faulty lead in cable or connector. Try swapping the lead in as a first attempt at a fix.

[Videonut]

No the connections appear to be OK.

In Perth as far as I know all transmitters are located close together along the local hills. I don't know if each provider uses different transmitting power or not but if they do that could possibly account for the difference in my signal & quality readings very from 45 to 100%.

As far as HD channels go it appears as follows

ABC = 1
SBS = 3
7 = 1
9 = 2
10 = 1

[Paul_oz53]

No the connections appear to be OK.

In Perth as far as I know all transmitters are located close together along the local hills. I don't know if each provider uses different transmitting power or not but if they do that could possibly account for the difference in my signal & quality readings very from 45 to 100%.

As far as HD channels go it appears as follows

ABC = 1
SBS = 3
7 = 1
9 = 2
10 = 1

Not sure how to interpret your scale. Is 1 good and 3 bad?

Regardless, has it always been like this or is it a new problem? If new then we need examine what has changed. If old then we look at it completely differently.

It's highly unlikely that the fluctuations in signal strength will be so severe for the main channels unless you are located in a gully with limited visibility to some transmitters. Some insight into your location will help.

A more likely explanation for the variability is your aerial is an older analogue version, not a digital aerial. But is it?

Cheers,

[MrQuade]

Just out of curiosity. The channels reported with "1s" correspond with the highest and lowest frequencies being broadcast in Perth.
I get bad signal on Ten and ABC, and I suspect whatever the cause is, it is related to their higher frequency being more susceptible to my house's wiring deficiencies, or water ingress.


Seven = 177.5 MHz
SBS = 184.5 MHz
Nine = 191.5 MHz
Ten = 219.5 MHz
ABC = 226.5 MHz

[prl]

In Perth as far as I know all transmitters are located close together along the local hills.

That's certainly where the main transmitters are (Bickley/Carmel). But there are also "fill-in" transmitters in Perth city (West Bank Tower), Perth Coastal in Scarborough, and at Rolystone. They're all much lower power than the Bickley/Carmel transmitters.

I don't know if each provider uses different transmitting power or not but if they do that could possibly account for the difference in my signal & quality readings very from 45 to 100%.

All of the transmitters at Bickley/Carmel are 50kW, except for West TV, which has a 200kW transmitter. All 5 main networks have two transmitters each, one at Bickley and one at Carmel.

If any of the main networks you're receiving are UHF (above 500MHz), they're not being transmitted from Bickley/Carmel, which only broadcasts on VHF frequencies (below 250MHz). West TV is on UHF from Carmel.

[Paul_oz53]

In Perth as far as I know all transmitters are located close together along the local hills.

That's certainly where the main transmitters are (Bickley/Carmel). But there are also "fill-in" transmitters in Perth city (West Bank Tower), Perth Coastal in Scarborough, and at Rolystone. They're all much lower power than the Bickley/Carmel transmitters.

I don't know if each provider uses different transmitting power or not but if they do that could possibly account for the difference in my signal & quality readings very from 45 to 100%.

All of the transmitters at Bickley/Carmel are 50kW, except for West TV, which has a 200kW transmitter. All 5 main networks have two transmitters each, one at Bickley and one at Carmel.

If any of the main networks you're receiving are UHF (above 500MHz), they're not being transmitted from Bickley/Carmel, which only broadcasts on VHF frequencies (below 250MHz). West TV is on UHF from Carmel.

That's very instructive prl.

On my U4's I have to retune in daytime hours to avoid them locking in on the Melbourne UHF channel repeaters. When this happens I get terrible reception on 9 and 10 until I manually retune their respective VHF channels.

Videonut, I suggest you check the frequencies of each network to see if you are getting a similar effect. You may need a combined VHF / UHF aerial to improve things.

I use the OverlayHD skin which shows the frequency in the lower left corner if you press ok while on a service. Not sure if the other skins are similar.

[IanB]

....
I get bad signal on Ten and ABC, and I suspect whatever the cause is, it is related to their higher frequency being more susceptible to my house's wiring deficiencies, or water ingress.


Seven = 177.5 MHz - VHF6
SBS = 184.5 MHz - VHF7
Nine = 191.5 MHz - VHF8
Ten = 219.5 MHz - VHF11
ABC = 226.5 MHz - VHF12

You possibly have an older design antenna cut for only the lower band III frequencies, this was common in the analogue days, covering typically only 184.5 to 212.5 MHz (VHF7-10).

Or maybe the shorter elements are damaged reducing the efficiency at the higher frequencies.

[MrQuade]

Or maybe the shorter elements are damaged reducing the efficiency at the higher frequencies.

I definitely had the shorter elements, though can't vouch for the condition. The birds do enjoy sitting on then after all.

The fact that those two channels go to pot on the train makes me suspect that there is just water getting into the connectors and/or cable. I never got up enough enthusiasm to call in a technician to replace that and rewire everything though (also needed more outlets so was a good excuse to do a clean sweep)

[Videonut]

All of the discussion about TV transmissions make me recall something that I heard said once before.

I heard the suggestion the all radio/tv would eventually be coming to your house through NBN. Is this just nonsense or is it ever likely to happen?

[MrQuade]

I heard the suggestion the all radio/tv would eventually be coming to your house through NBN. Is this just nonsense or is it ever likely to happen?

You can already receive pretty much all TV and radio through official sources via NBN, however these won't be replacing traditional broadcasts any time soon. There are still advantages to receiving more conventional non-IP broadcast services.

[Videonut]

I've done some more testing and looked at signal strength and quality of every channel and only channels 9 and 10 score 100% every time. All other services breaks up all of the time.

Recent stormy weather made my antenna seem to be the number one culprit for the problem but I'm starting to doubt that now.

What I have done is to use my old Topfield 7160 which I haven't used for a few years and set it up to record some of the exact same programs at the exact same time.

These recordings playback without any problem. I still can't remember how to use the old machine and how to say transfer off any program that I might want  to keep.

So where does that leave me as it doesn't look like that antenna is the problem.
It would appear to be the T2 itself is the problem and I don't know if there's anything that I can do about this except to see if anyone has other suggestions.

Would an antenna amplifier help? Or could it be the HDMI cable that's going to my TV from my T2.  

The Topfield is using a different HDMI cable, or anything else that you might be able to suggest.

My TV has 4 HDMI inputs and all of them are used. Might swapping them about help?

[raymondjpg]

These recordings playback without any problem. I still can't remember how to use the old machine and how to say transfer off any program that I might want  to keep.

I'm pretty sure that all of the Topfield PVRs had an FTP server that needed to be enabled in settings, and a login name and password applied. I always used numbers for both to avoid any case sensitivity issues. Then use something like Filezilla to transfer the programs to your PC.

I had a 7160 at some point before the T/U/V series of PVRs and as I recall it was the first PVR that I had seen which could be set up for remote access for setting timers and managing recordings from a PC.

[Videonut]

I have used Filezilla to transfer files from T2 & back again. I have never got it to work with the Toppy. Then again I have never been able to get networking set up on my T2 I have yet to encounter anyone who would help,

[MrQuade]

Then again I have never been able to get networking set up on my T2 I have yet to encounter anyone who would help,

Have you asked? There are at least half a dozen people who will pile on any time a networking question comes up.

[raymondjpg]

I have used Filezilla to transfer files from T2 & back again. I have never got it to work with the Toppy. Then again I have never been able to get networking set up on my T2 I have yet to encounter anyone who would help,

It's been a while since I set up a Topfield, but as I recall I always set up the LAN networking first, then the FTP server, from the Topfield GUI. I'm not sure if the FTP server in the Topfield would work without setting up the networking first, but from what you say you were able to get FTP working on a T2 without doing that. I really don't know how and why that works.

[prl]

Enabling FTP on the Beyonwiz simply allows the FTP server to run. To connect to it, the network must be configured and running correctly. To use it to list and transfer files, a password must be set for the Beyonwiz's root user account (in MENU>Setup>Network>Password).

[Paul_oz53]

Videonut, re the picture breakup problem, yes an amplifier can help but before you do that, you need to be sure it's the answer.

1. You might simply have an open shield on your antenna wiring. I had this and it affected all bar two networks. Given the Toppy worked ok probably not the problem but check by swapping over the antenna cable lead-in.

2. For one of the dodgy channels, make sure on the T2 you are on the best frequency for that channel. I retuned a while back and my U4 kept locking into uhf repeaters rather than vhf on some stations, with massive breakup problems on those uhf channels.

On the OverlayHD skin the frequency is in the bottom left corner of the infoscreen. If you are in an area with two frequency options it may be worth checking if a better reception option is available.

Backup your settings first. Then perform a manual predefined transponder scan for the channel on its vhf channel if the current frequency is above 250MHz. Or tune the uhf repeater for your area if the frequency is below 250MHz.

After that, you can tune to a station by accessing Menu > Channels > Last Scanned. If the reception is better then the messy task of curating Favourites arises. If not, restore the backup.

[Videonut]

I have been using my old Topfield to record the exact same programs as on my T2. All of these recordings played back without a problem.

But I'm amazed to report that the recordings made on my T2 just as well with no picture break up. I have no explanation for this change although I sure hope that it lasts.

I had checked out my antenna and asked the neighbours if they had had problems but nothing bad was reported. This has happened 3 nights in a row so hopefully this will continue although it would be nice to be able to explain the change.

Thanks for the help.

[Videonut]

I wrote that last posting too soon. After 3 days in a row when the problem didn't occur its now back again. So I have have to call in an antenna guy.