T4 - hard drive format and largest size disk

[ample]

Hi

I've recently acquired a used T4 (sorry, don't know what software version, can check later if important). It had a 2TB internal drive, which I think was fitted by the previous owner (T4 was 'bare bones').

Please could somebody help me with the following:

1. What format is used by the internal drive? Is it the case that, if it was formatted by the T4, it is not in NTFS format but some other format whose name escapes me?

2. Can the internal HDD be removed from the machine and placed in a HDD docking station (or powered enclosure) and allow full access to all its content via a USB connection?

3. What is the largest capacity HDD which the machine can support, either internally or USB-connected?

4. For USB connection, what is the largest drive which can be supported and still give a reasonable response time (e.g.initial access, sorting content list)?

5. Same as (4.) for internally-mounted HDD

6. I might buy a WD 4TB Red HDD for use either internally or externally. Does this sound OK, or would one of the other 'colours' be advisable?

7. Does the T4 support a connected PC for easy file management e.g. a GUI-based file manager interface for 'drag and drop' moving of multiple files from one drive to another? (Presumably a lot faster connected to the T4 by a cable rather than over wifi.)

Many thanks
Paul

[MrQuade]

1. What format is used by the internal drive? Is it the case that, if it was formatted by the T4, it is not in NTFS format but some other format whose name escapes me?

ext4 if it was formatted in the standard fashion in the T4. Any suitable Linux based distro can read it. Windows and MacOS can as well with some effort (but not by default).

2. Can the internal HDD be removed from the machine and placed in a HDD docking station (or powered enclosure) and allow full access to all its content via a USB connection?

Yep. Either a USB or a eSATA dock will do the trick. The dock will need a separate power supply though, as it can't pull enough power from the USB port.

3. What is the largest capacity HDD which the machine can support, either internally or USB-connected?

Exabytes. You can't buy a HDD that is too big .

4. For USB connection, what is the largest drive which can be supported and still give a reasonable response time (e.g.initial access, sorting content list)?

5. Same as (4.) for internally-mounted HDD

Same answer to both. It depends how you organise the files. The time delay is mostly down to the number of items in the directory you are trying to read. If you have more than a few hundred items in a directory, then I would look at an alternative sorting method.

6. I might buy a WD 4TB Red HDD for use either internally or externally. Does this sound OK, or would one of the other 'colours' be advisable?

Cheapest would be best. There is no performance advantage, and you are really just buying a warranty more than anything. Red is optimised for consistency in RAID arrays. Purple is supposed to be more suitable for always-on applications. Greens are cheapest and just as good.

7. Does the T4 support a connected PC for easy file management e.g. a GUI-based file manager interface for 'drag and drop' moving of multiple files from one drive to another? (Presumably a lot faster connected to the T4 by a cable rather than over wifi.)

The "Movie" directory is shared over the network with the SMB protocol and is not password protected. Any Windows or Mac can see and read/write to that folder as if it were just attached storage.

The T4 can push about 50MB/s in terms of data throughput on its Gigabit Ethernet interface (CPU speed is the limitation).

The filesystem is also accessible via FTP and SCP once you have set up a network password.

Don't you have a T2 already? The T4 is practically identical in operation, it just has more hardware capabilities.

Since the T4 is inherited, then I would advise that you start out with a new firmware installation from the latest USB image here:
viewtopic.php?f=45&t=13155

[ample]

HI

Thanks for the detailed reply. Sorry for the delay in getting back to you, have had some health problems (after-effects of chemo and bone marrow transplant, leading to a lot of fatigue and general inability to get much done).

Yes, I do have a T2, which also has a full HDD (1.5TB). Now that the T4 2TB HDD is nearly full (as well as at least one external USB HDD) I must admit that I am wondering if my wife and I will ever get around to watching even a fraction of what we've recorded! It's just so easy to record stuff, especially with the (reliable!) four tuners on the T4! However, it is handy to have a wide range of stuff recorded for when we fell like watching something particular. Planning to sell he T2 at some point.

So.. I'm wondering what to do to get more storage for the T4. A 4TB 2.5 inch USB Seagate "Backup plus" drive is only $158 in Officeworks at the moment, though I imagine that it's a 5200 RPM drive, so probably not the fastest. I could just plug one of those in, along with the other couple of USB hard drives which already have a lot of content on them (multiple USB drives connected to a powered USB hub - would that work OK)? Could move the content so that one drive is for movies, one for documentaries, one for miscellaneous etc.

The other option would be to put move the internal 3.5 inch 2TB drive to an external enclosure and then put, say, a 4TB 3.5 inch drive in the T4 (as described in original post). Access/sorting time might be a bit faster (7200 RPM drive?) but it would cost more (4TB 3.5 drives seem to be around $170+, without the enclosure).

One issue is that (I think) all my content is in the root directory, not the Movie folder, so may not be accessible to a connected PC for easy file bulk file transfer.

Any thoughts and suggestions welcome.

Thanks
Paul

PS Yes, I'll do the T4 firmware upgrade. Current system info as per screen shot.

T4 system info 20190514.jpg (447.53 KiB) Viewed 2244 times

[Paul_oz53]

5400 rpm drives are quite adequate for the T4. They are less noisy and they cope well with up to the maximum number of recordings.

My WD Blue 4TB can handle 12 recordings
simultaneously, which is the absolute maximum possible though I rarely get to 5 in normal use.

Internal or external is also a user choice. I mainly use internal storage but have about 25TB of externals, mainly USB 2 or 3. Like you, I wonder if I'll ever watch it all.

I tried esata but didn't find it any better than USB and SWMBO didn't like it sitting on the cabinet in plain view.

[ample]

Hello again

I've purchased a Seagate 4TB USB 'Backup Plus' drive with built in 2 port USB hub. The drive is already formatted for NTFS.

I turned off power to the T4, connected the new drive. I was recognised by the T4, but shows as "Not Mounted". Also cannot move files to it.

1. What do I need to do to mount it?

2. I have many TV content files in the root directory (I assume) of the T4 (ie. they are not in the Movie folder). Is there a way I can move these to the new 4TB USB drive using a computer?

3. The naming of the drives (sda1, sdb2, sdd1, sdd2, usb etc. ) seems a bit random and inconsistent. How can I make this easier, especially iwth multiple external drives attached to the T$?

4. It seems to me that when I try to Move a program to another drive using the green 'Move' button, sometimes the destination list doesn't show all the possible drives - or it shows some under different names compared with when they are listed after pressing the Media button and navigating up to the folder (..) at the top of the list of programs. How can I make sense of this?

I really like my T4, just need to ind a way to make using it more streamlined.

Thanks
Paul

PS haven't yet done the latest s/ware update - will do so soon. Does this included any improvements to the user interface, especially for file management?

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[adoxa]

1. What do I need to do to mount it?

Looks like the first partition is unused/something else, so it mounted the second partition /dev/sdb2, which you'll find as /media/sdb2 and is what I expect "Seagate Backup Plus Drive (Front USB Slot)" is.

2. I have many TV content files in the root directory (I assume) of the T4 (ie. they are not in the Movie folder). Is there a way I can move these to the new 4TB USB drive using a computer?

No need, use the "Seagate Backup..." option.

3. The naming of the drives (sda1, sdb2, sdd1, sdd2, usb etc. ) seems a bit random and inconsistent. How can I make this easier, especially iwth multiple external drives attached to the T$?

Simplistically, sd means SATA device, the letter is the slot and the number is the partition. I don't think you can easily name the mount point; you could possibly use a volume label to identify them in the location list. After updating the firmware you could also create an alias, but that won't work if you switch slots (it aliases the path, not the device).

4. It seems to me that when I try to Move a program to another drive using the green 'Move' button, sometimes the destination list doesn't show all the possible drives - or it shows some under different names compared with when they are listed after pressing the Media button and navigating up to the folder (..) at the top of the list of programs. How can I make sense of this?

Good question. You could use YELLOW to select the drive by name, then look at the top right to see its path.

[Grumpy_Geoff]

2. I have many TV content files in the root directory (I assume) of the T4 (ie. they are not in the Movie folder). Is there a way I can move these to the new 4TB USB drive using a computer?

Use File Commander (MENU>>Sources / Files) on the T4 to move them. File Commander shows the disk names, so you'll be able to identify the target device.
Turn on multi-file selection using the MEDIA button. You don't need to select every file making up the recording set, just selecting the '*.eit' file is enough to have the entire set copied.

3. The naming of the drives (sda1, sdb2, sdd1, sdd2, usb etc. ) seems a bit random and inconsistent. How can I make this easier, especially iwth multiple external drives attached to the T$?

The disk names are shown in your 'devices' screenshot, so you'll know which ones they are. They are sequenced according to the order they're discovered when booting.

PS haven't yet done the latest s/ware update - will do so soon. Does this included any improvements to the user interface, especially for file management?

Yes, an absolute shed load of improvements to File Commander in particular.

[ample]

Hi,

Just picking this up again after a long delay. Thanks for all the previous replies.

With the latest firmware update for the T4, is it possible to use an external PC with a GUI file manager (like File Explorer in Windows 10) via the LAN port to move mutiple content files from:

i) Internal HDD root directory (*not* Movie directory) to a new directory of my choosing on a new external USB HDD>

ii) Same thing, moving content files from the root directory of an existing external USB HDD (e.g. sdb2) to a directory of my choosing on a new external USB HDD?

At the moment, my content files aren't sorted into folders, they're all piled into the root directories of the internal and external HDDs - hundreds of files. I'd like add a new external 4TB or 6TB HDD and create folders like:

- films
- docos
- sport
- news

etc. and then move the appropriate files there from the internal and external HDDs. There will be hundred of files to be moved.

Q1. The T4 is is in the lounge room plugged into the ethernet LAN. Wil I be able to use a spare in my office (also connected to the LAN) to do all this moving around so I can be doing other things on my main PC in my study while it runs? I assume that it will have to put each file up to the PC and then move it back to the new drive - there will be a lot of adat flowing around the network!

The actual set up is that the T$ is plugged into teh router in the hall, and gigabit ethernet switch in study is connected to another port on the router. My main PC is pluged into the switch . The second PC, dedciated to file management on the T4, would be plugged into another port on the data switch.

Q2. Any issues with this? I assume that the router and the switch will manage the traffic so I can still use my main PC on the internet without it slowing to a crawl!?

Q3. If I use the Windows FIle Explorer GUI to highlight, drag and drop *multiple* files from, say, the internal HDD root to, say, Docos folder on the new USB HDD, will they be queued up and transferred ASAP, as in the usual way of managing multiple Windows files in a single operation? Is there a danger of trying of move too many files in one operation and confusing or overloading the management PC or the T4 itself?

Q4. Instead of using another USB-connected HDD, I suppose it would be possible to use an ethernet-connected drive ('network storage' plugged into teh router or a spare port on the swicth in my study or a new swicth added in the ethernet connection to the T4 (i.e. in the YV cabinet). Would there be any advantage fron doing this? Does network-connected storage display differently in the list of devices in the T4's UI? (e.g. different from hdd, sdb1, sdb2, etc.)

Many thanks
Paul

[MrQuade]

With the latest firmware update for the T4, is it possible to use an external PC with a GUI file manager (like File Explorer in Windows 10) via the LAN port to move mutiple content files from:

i) Internal HDD root directory (*not* Movie directory) to a new directory of my choosing on a new external USB HDD>

ii) Same thing, moving content files from the root directory of an existing external USB HDD (e.g. sdb2) to a directory of my choosing on a new external USB HDD?

Nothing has changed in the latest firmware in that regard.

One thing to remember is that if you are moving files between physical disks from a remote GUI interface, then you are likely to be actually copying the files up to your remote device, then back down to the T4, effectively sending them over the network twice. That sort of transfer can take longer to complete.

You have a few options for moving files around. SMB (Windows networking), ftp, or scp.
With ftp and scp, you have access to the full T4 filesystem, once the root password is set.
With SMB, you only have access the the movie directory on the internal harddisk by default.
In order to gain access to other drives, or the root directory, you need to manually edit the smb configuration files on the T4 to add new shares. (shares are configured in /etc/samba/smb-user.conf) There are a few posts floating around that discuss the various ways of adding shares either manually, or via script.

At the moment, my content files aren't sorted into folders, they're all piled into the root directories of the internal and external HDDs - hundreds of files. I'd like add a new external 4TB or 6TB HDD and create folders like:

- films
- docos
- sport
- news

etc. and then move the appropriate files there from the internal and external HDDs. There will be hundred of files to be moved.

The built in file manager allows you to select multiple files and move them in a group to a new location. If that new location is on the same disk, then the move operation will take place very quickly.
What you could do is move all the files to a subfolder of the movie directory, and then use your PC's remote connection to organise the files to your preference. The organised files can then be moved off to whatever storage destination you like via the T4's file manager.

Q1. The T4 is is in the lounge room plugged into the ethernet LAN. Wil I be able to use a spare in my office (also connected to the LAN) to do all this moving around so I can be doing other things on my main PC in my study while it runs? I assume that it will have to put each file up to the PC and then move it back to the new drive - there will be a lot of adat flowing around the network!

Yep, as above.

The actual set up is that the T$ is plugged into teh router in the hall, and gigabit ethernet switch in study is connected to another port on the router. My main PC is pluged into the switch . The second PC, dedciated to file management on the T4, would be plugged into another port on the data switch.

Q2. Any issues with this? I assume that the router and the switch will manage the traffic so I can still use my main PC on the internet without it slowing to a crawl!?

As long as the devices are all plugged into the same gigabit LAN segment, then it will have zero net effect on your Internet speed.

Q3. If I use the Windows FIle Explorer GUI to highlight, drag and drop *multiple* files from, say, the internal HDD root to, say, Docos folder on the new USB HDD, will they be queued up and transferred ASAP, as in the usual way of managing multiple Windows files in a single operation? Is there a danger of trying of move too many files in one operation and confusing or overloading the management PC or the T4 itself?

No, it will just take a long time, and should the transfer be interrupted somewhere in the middle, then you would need to just figure out what you were up to and manually kick it off again.

Q4. Instead of using another USB-connected HDD, I suppose it would be possible to use an ethernet-connected drive ('network storage' plugged into teh router or a spare port on the swicth in my study or a new swicth added in the ethernet connection to the T4 (i.e. in the YV cabinet). Would there be any advantage fron doing this? Does network-connected storage display differently in the list of devices in the T4's UI? (e.g. different from hdd, sdb1, sdb2, etc.)

A NAS is a much neater way to manage your files, and I would definitely recommend that over directly attached USB storage.
The NAS storage will be mounted and presented in a more or less identical way to any other USB or internal storage. It just gets attached to a different place in the T4's overall file system.

[ample]

You have a few options for moving files around. SMB (Windows networking), ftp, or scp.
With ftp and scp, you have access to the full T4 filesystem, once the root password is set.
With SMB, you only have access the the movie directory on the internal harddisk by default.
In order to gain access to other drives, or the root directory, you need to manually edit the smb configuration files on the T4 to add new shares. (shares are configured in /etc/samba/smb-user.conf) There are a few posts floating around that discuss the various ways of adding shares either manually, or via script.

Many thanks for your reply - very comprehensive, as ever.

1. I assume that SMB (Windows networking) is plug and play? However, the T4 and my Windows 10 machine are plugged itno the same 4-port router (the Win PC via an ethernet switch) but I can't see the T4 in File Explorer on the PC. Do I need to enable networking on the T4 somehow?

2. Regarding FTP and SCP: Can that be done remotely using a dedicated PC in my study via the LAN? I guees I'd need to search this forum for instructions.

3. Alternatively, I think I understood teh suggestion of using the local T4 interface (with the remote control) to bulk-move everything from the root directory on the internal HDD to the Movie directory and the use Windows File Explorer to move the files to the desired destination directories. All future recording to teh HDD in the T4 should be ot teh Movie directory (set up the recording default accordingly). Is that correct?

4. What is the benefit of using a NAS rather than USB-connected hard drives? (I have a Seagate 4TB USB hard drive which includes a hub and two USB sockets for connecting further devices, so three USB drives can be connected to one USB port on the T4.)

5. A concern about using large external hard drives: When first accessing "Media" using the remote control, there can be quite a long delay (a few seconds, maybe five?) while the external HDD spins up from standby. If there are a large number of files in a fiven directory there is presumably a further delay while the T4 reads the directory contents listing, sorts it according to the specifies order (typically reverse date) and then displays teh list. Is this a reason to use smaller external drives, smaller partitions or smaller number of content files in a greater number of directories (e.g. docos1, docos2, docos3... etc.?

Thanks
Paul

[MrQuade]

1. I assume that SMB (Windows networking) is plug and play? However, the T4 and my Windows 10 machine are plugged itno the same 4-port router (the Win PC via an ethernet switch) but I can't see the T4 in File Explorer on the PC. Do I need to enable networking on the T4 somehow?

Yep, should be all automatic assuming your network is all set up correctly.
You're best off having both the PC and the T4 network settings configured for DHCP addresses. That way, both devices will register themselves with your router's DNS server, and they can talk to eachother by name more easily.

If the Windows Explorer doesn't automatically just see the T4 on the network, you can also reach the T4 by typing \\beyonwizt4\ directly into the address bar.

2. Regarding FTP and SCP: Can that be done remotely using a dedicated PC in my study via the LAN? I guees I'd need to search this forum for instructions.

Yes, those are different network protocols that are used for transferring files. They won't let you play or edit files while they are sitting in place on the T4 from your PC, but they will let you copy files to and from the PC to the T4.
There are various programs availabile to use either of those. I use WinSCP for those sorts of tasks (can use ftp or scp). Windows also have basic built in tools for ftp (you can run "ftp beyonwizt4" from a command line, or you can access the T4 from a browser with "ftp://beyonwizt4")

3. Alternatively, I think I understood teh suggestion of using the local T4 interface (with the remote control) to bulk-move everything from the root directory on the internal HDD to the Movie directory and the use Windows File Explorer to move the files to the desired destination directories. All future recording to teh HDD in the T4 should be ot teh Movie directory (set up the recording default accordingly). Is that correct?

Yep, the T4 natively uses the Movie directory for most of its recording and file organisation functions, so best just to leave stuff there IMHO.

4. What is the benefit of using a NAS rather than USB-connected hard drives? (I have a Seagate 4TB USB hard drive which includes a hub and two USB sockets for connecting further devices, so three USB drives can be connected to one USB port on the T4.)

Not having to have additional drives sitting around in your AV cabinet making a clutter and adding extra heat and noise is one.
A NAS is also handy in that they can be configured for hardware fault tolerance in that you can arrange the disks as a RAID, so that that loss of one disk (or more disks depending on RAID mode) will not result in loss of data. You can set up a single NAS with oodles of room.

5. A concern about using large external hard drives: When first accessing "Media" using the remote control, there can be quite a long delay (a few seconds, maybe five?) while the external HDD spins up from standby. If there are a large number of files in a fiven directory there is presumably a further delay while the T4 reads the directory contents listing, sorts it according to the specifies order (typically reverse date) and then displays teh list. Is this a reason to use smaller external drives, smaller partitions or smaller number of content files in a greater number of directories (e.g. docos1, docos2, docos3... etc.?

Not really, the time required to read even large directories is not that long. Over a slower network connection it can take a few seconds, but good file organisation can help solve that.

One thing I will mention though, is that is probably best to not allow disks to spin down if they are supposed to be an "always available" resource. And this goes even more so for NAS drives, and the NAS itself (you shouldn't really let a NAS go into sleep mode if you can help it). Spinning drives down can actually shorten their lifespans as they go through multiple heating and cooling cycles, and puts additional strain on motors to accelerate the platters to speed. And there is of course the inconvenience factor of having to wait for them to become available. Even more of an inconvenience is if your device doesn't gracefully handle the wait for the disk to spin up, and operations time out and storage becomes temporarily unavailable until you reboot, or take some other similarly inconvenient action.

[prl]

1. I assume that SMB (Windows networking) is plug and play? However, the T4 and my Windows 10 machine are plugged itno the same 4-port router (the Win PC via an ethernet switch) but I can't see the T4 in File Explorer on the PC. Do I need to enable networking on the T4 somehow?

You do need to configure networking on the T4, but that should be done as part of your initial setup. Once networking is set up, the Samba Windows filesharing server on the T4 should run automatically, unless you have explicitly disabled it.

2. Regarding FTP and SCP: Can that be done remotely using a dedicated PC in my study via the LAN? I guees I'd need to search this forum for instructions.

I'm not sure what "Can that be done remotely using a dedicated PC in my study via the LAN?" really means. FTP and SSH (which scp uses) are connection protocols (though ssh is also the name of an SSH client).

To use FTP, you need an FTP client on your PC, FileZilla is a commonly use one, but if you prefer another one, that should be fine. You also need to set the access password on the T4 in MENU>Setup>Network>Password.

To use SSH and its file transfer services, you need a suitable SSH client. In the past I've used Putty as a Windows remote terminal client for SSH, but I don't know whether current versions of Putty support file transfer. Personally I use the U*ix commands ssh and scp for SSH terminal connections and file copying.

For SSH you need to either set up a password as for FTP, or create public/private key pairs for SSH access. The latter is more complicated, but it has the advantage of being single-signon. To install the public key on the T4, you'll need to use either FTP of scp using a password to copy the key, or use a USB stick and the Beyonwiz File Commander (MENU>Files / Sources).

You should be able to use either method to copy the files using a PC on your home network.

3. Alternatively, I think I understood teh suggestion of using the local T4 interface (with the remote control) to bulk-move everything from the root directory on the internal HDD to the Movie directory and the use Windows File Explorer to move the files to the desired destination directories. All future recording to teh HDD in the T4 should be ot teh Movie directory (set up the recording default accordingly). Is that correct?

5. A concern about using large external hard drives: When first accessing "Media" using the remote control, there can be quite a long delay (a few seconds, maybe five?) while the external HDD spins up from standby. If there are a large number of files in a fiven directory there is presumably a further delay while the T4 reads the directory contents listing, sorts it according to the specifies order (typically reverse date) and then displays teh list. Is this a reason to use smaller external drives, smaller partitions or smaller number of content files in a greater number of directories (e.g. docos1, docos2, docos3... etc.?

It's hard to answer why there is a delay in starting up the Media selection screen without knowing roughly how many files there are in the directory. The time to start it up should not be affected by the total size of the disk or the total amount of spaced used on it.

[Paul_oz53]

Personally, I think that adding the folder you want to access to SMB-user.conf is easy to do and will allow you to access the folder from the PC using windows explorer.

If you can see the movies folder on the PC all you need to add is:

Code: Select all

[targetfolder]
   comment = /targetfolder
   path = /targetfolder (including path if not a subfolder of root)
   guest ok = yes
   read only = no
   

The hardest part for a tinkerer like me is getting the target folder name and path correct but once set, all should be good. For example, the movie folder path is

Code: Select all

/media/hdd/movie

Save a backup before you edit anything. After you finish moving files you can reverse any changes by restoring the backup if you want.

It is easy enough to see the Wiz folder structure using the file commander to access Internal flash. See Menu>>Sources / Files

Navigate to /etc/samba to find the smb-user.conf file. You can edit the file directly whilst there. You should not edit any of the other files though you can inspect them to get an understanding of how they work.

In theory you should restart the network, restart the GUI or reboot but I've generally found that these edits are effective virtually immediately.

[ample]

Thanks, both.

Following up:

1. What are the advantages of using a NAS as opposed to mutiple USB hard drives? (Apart from the most, one of my concerns about a NAS is the amount of power it will use - or does it shut right down to power save when not being used)?

2.

If you can see the movies folder on the PC all you need to add is:
Code: Select all

[targetfolder]
comment = /targetfolder
path = /targetfolder (including path if not a subfolder of root)
guest ok = yes
read only = no

Where is this added? I assume it's being written into the T4 somewhere. but not sure where. If I want to access the internal HDD root folder on the external Win 10 PC, what is the exact code to be inserted? Is something put in place of the term " targetfolder " or is that part of the code?

Cheers
Paul, Melb

[Paul_oz53]

Hi Paul.

The file to be altered is smb-user.conf.

You should go to your T4 and press Menu >> Sources/Files. This is the File commander. Use it to open Internal flash.

You are now looking at the Wiz operating system.

Open the directory "etc". Navigate to "samba". You should see "smb-user.conf" listed. Select the file and press enter.

Now navigate to a blank line near the end and press enter. Type in the lines you need. I use a USB keyboard to do this. Use the blue key to add more lines. Press OK to edit a line and OK to exit. If happy with the file press RED to exit and then answer yes to the save dialog.

The terminology you're using is a little confusing. Replace "targetfolder" with an actual folder name.

The term "root" can mean the whole of the operating system and targetfolder for that is simply "/". Omit the quotes. However, this is more than you probably need and access to the root is strongly discouraged as a rule.

You probably want "/media/hdd" or just "/media" as your target folder.

In fact I have three PCs and five USB drives networked to four Wizzes and can move files between them all in minutes. I'll leave it to others to explain the benefits of a NAS.

[peteru]

scp / sftp and other secure protocols that use encryption are definitely the preferred method for remote access, but...

Very large file transfers that use ssh for transport will take significantly longer than simple FTP operations. And all of those will take way too long when compared between directly attached drives.

In other words, if you can avoid copying over the network do so. If you can't, then use plain FTP for this particular job.

[MrQuade]

1. What are the advantages of using a NAS as opposed to mutiple USB hard drives? (Apart from the most, one of my concerns about a NAS is the amount of power it will use - or does it shut right down to power save when not being used)?

I answered that one in my previous reply, but in short, reduced clutter, and data integrity/safety.
A NAS is also a multifunction device that can be used for quite a lot more than just storing recordings. Most good ones have a whole suite of functions on your home network.

The NAS will use about 30W a full tilt and more like 15W steady state. It should cost less than $50/yr in power to run one 24/7.

[ample]

Personally, I think that adding the folder you want to access to SMB-user.conf is easy to do and will allow you to access the folder from the PC using windows explorer.

If you can see the movies folder on the PC all you need to add is:

Code: Select all

[targetfolder]
   comment = /targetfolder
   path = /targetfolder (including path if not a subfolder of root)
   guest ok = yes
   read only = no
   

The hardest part for a tinkerer like me is getting the target folder name and path correct but once set, all should be good. For example, the movie folder path is

Code: Select all

/media/hdd/movie

Save a backup before you edit anything. After you finish moving files you can reverse any changes by restoring the backup if you want.

It is easy enough to see the Wiz folder structure using the file commander to access Internal flash. See Menu>>Sources / Files

Navigate to /etc/samba to find the smb-user.conf file. You can edit the file directly whilst there. You should not edit any of the other files though you can inspect them to get an understanding of how they work.

In theory you should restart the network, restart the GUI or reboot but I've generally found that these edits are effective virtually immediately.

------

Hello again

Sorry to say I haven't made progress with this due to some health and other pressing issues. But now I really must do something about it as disc space is nearly exhausted.

I've looked into using a NAS but the cost is significantly higher than using USB-connected hard drives (e.g. at Officeworks, WD 8TB MyCloud NAS is $469 whereas 8TB Seagate USB hard drive is $316 (a WD 8TB USB hard drive is $345, with two pass-though USB ports for daisy-chaining drives).

Also, I already have a couple of external USB drives with content on them which I would like to retain.

My aim is to be able to use the PC via the LAN to create new folders on any of the USB hard drives (e.g. Comedy films, Drama films, Other films, Music, Sports etc.) and move content files to them via the PC using Windows Explorer, Teracopy etc. I have observed (as previously pointed out in the thread) that transfers over the network are quite slow (max. ~ 50 MBps) but I have a second I can dedicate to this, so I would line 'em and let it run for as many hours as needed.

Before I start adding lines of code to my T4 (which I must admit I am slightly nervous about), I would just like to check that what I am proposing will actually work.

(Q1.) In other words, with this additional code installed, will my PC be able to see the internal HDD (root directory as well as "Movie" directory, as well as four (say) external USB hard drives, and then be able to create and delete folders on all these devices and move content files between them?

(Q2.) If I am trying to set this up for multiple drives, do I have to modify the code above and put in multiple lines where it says content= /targetfolder ?> If so, please could you elaborate on this? (I'm still not sure what I would put in place of "targetfolder" - if that specifies a folder, where do I specify which drive it is on?)

(Q3.) Also, if this can be made to work, are these USB drives then available on the network for other file storage purposes? In other words, does the T4 make those USB drives into NAS drives?

One other thing, which may be relevant: In my tinkering to date, I have noticed the following when trying to access the T4 from my computer via the LAN using Windows 10 Explorer:

If I enter: beyonwizt4 , it opens a browser winoidw and takes me to a web-like page user interface for the T4. This is quite handy, as it lets me access the EPG and program the T4 from my home office (via the LAN). (This is a bit of a surprise to me - it's the first time I've seen Windows Explorer open a browser window.)

If I type in \\beyonwizt4\ , the first few times I try I usually get an error message on a pop-up dialog box saying "Cannot access beyonwizt4" (or similar), with a button to open a diagnostic tool (which doesn't help). I then try again, up to 3 or 4 times, and eventually it displays icons for the "Logs" folder and "Movie" folder on teh T4. I then open the MOvie folder and cut and paste collections of files to my Pc or to OneDrive cloud storage.

(Q4.) About 10% of the time I get the Logs and Movie folder icons on the first attempt, but usually it takes multiple attempts. Why is this?

Many thanks in advance.

Regards
Paul
Melbourne

[Paul_oz53]

...

My aim is to be able to use the PC via the LAN to create new folders on any of the USB hard drives (e.g. Comedy films, Drama films, Other films, Music, Sports etc.) and move content files to them via the PC using Windows Explorer, Teracopy etc.
...
Before I start adding lines of code to my T4 (which I must admit I am slightly nervous about), I would just like to check that what I am proposing will actually work.

Before changing anything, take a backup. Even better, take one the day before too. That makes recovery relatively easy.

The changes you make to smb-user.conf won't affect the operation of the T4 per se. If a lot of network traffic is demanded of the T4 that will be a limiting factor.

(Q1.) In other words, with this additional code installed, will my PC be able to see the internal HDD (root directory as well as "Movie" directory, as well as four (say) external USB hard drives, and then be able to create and delete folders on all these devices and move content files between them?

A qualified yes. Network performance will be important as noted. My PCs can see 4 Wizzes, attached USB drives and all the shared directories including root, logs, Movies, USB, etc. Full read/write access. Multiple USB drives on one machine works too. Having multiple USB drives on one Wiz is not recommended as peteru explained in this post.

(Q2.) If I am trying to set this up for multiple drives, do I have to modify the code above and put in multiple lines where it says content= /targetfolder ?> If so, please could you elaborate on this? (I'm still not sure what I would put in place of "targetfolder" - if that specifies a folder, where do I specify which drive it is on?)

Easiest way to do this is to use Grumpy_Geoff's script. The script contains the detail you seek.

(Q3.) Also, if this can be made to work, are these USB drives then available on the network for other file storage purposes? In other words, does the T4 make those USB drives into NAS drives?

They can be accessed similar to a NAS but they are not a NAS resource. They may be unstable as peteru cautions and obviously, the T4 was never designed to manage network requests from multiple machines.

One other thing, which may be relevant: In my tinkering to date, I have noticed the following when trying to access the T4 from my computer via the LAN using Windows 10 Explorer:

If I enter: beyonwizt4 , it opens a browser window and takes me to a web-like page user interface for the T4. This is quite handy, as it lets me access the EPG and program the T4 from my home office (via the LAN). (This is a bit of a surprise to me - it's the first time I've seen Windows Explorer open a browser window.)

You have found the inbuilt Openwebif interface, which is very popular. It allows a lot of access to and control over the Wiz.

If I type in \\beyonwizt4\ , the first few times I try I usually get an error message on a pop-up dialog box saying "Cannot access beyonwizt4" (or similar), with a button to open a diagnostic tool (which doesn't help). I then try again, up to 3 or 4 times, and eventually it displays icons for the "Logs" folder and "Movie" folder on teh T4. I then open the MOvie folder and cut and paste collections of files to my Pc or to OneDrive cloud storage.


(Q4.) About 10% of the time I get the Logs and Movie folder icons on the first attempt, but usually it takes multiple attempts. Why is this?

...

Welcome to the vagaries of Windows networking. I use router assigned IP addresses to MAC addresses of each device. It greatly reduces this problem.

[Grumpy_Geoff]

Before I start adding lines of code to my T4 (which I must admit I am slightly nervous about), I would just like to check that what I am proposing will actually work.

Have you updated the firmware on the T4?