Auto Timer

[Trial_Master]

Hello
I am mucking around with Auto Timers with latest firmware and I must say it’s quite easy for recording reoccurring shows now. If I wanted to loosen the filtering to pick up any instances of a show that will return in the future I’m assuming you just remove any time, day and channel filters?

[Grumpy_Geoff]

Yes.
I normally wouldn't apply "time, day and channel filters" unless the situation demands it.

[Trial_Master]

I’ll have a fiddle with these for a week or so. It looks like it will meet most of the functionality that I am paying ICE for currently.

[Grumpy_Geoff]

If you've just started with AutoTimers, then have a read of "A quick guide to Beyonwiz T series AutoTimers".
Then read it again.

[Trial_Master]

OMG. Thanks for that. I’ll work my way through

[Grumpy_Geoff]

Also, you may find creating/editing AutoTimer definitions using OpenWebif is far easier than using the UI. There's an example screenshot in the linked post.

[Trial_Master]

Thanks, I’ll take a look at that one too. If I built a big stash of these is it possible to back them up and restore if required? If that’s covered in your links apologises.

[Grumpy_Geoff]

The AutoTimer definitions are stored in file /etc/enigma2/autotimer.xml. They are backed up when you perform a settings backup and are restored with it.
You can manually copy the file and then later put it back if you've set up from scratch, but that replacement process requires you to use command line access to stop the GUI, replace the file, and restart the GUI (otherwise a file replaced by any other copying mechanism would be overwritten with the in-memory version when the GUI shuts down).

[Trial_Master]

Right. All good info. Thanks again.

[Trial_Master]

You can manually copy the file and then later put it back if you've set up from scratch, but that replacement process requires you to use command line access to stop the GUI, replace the file, and restart the GUI (otherwise a file replaced by any other copying mechanism would be overwritten with the in-memory version when the GUI shuts down).

Geoff

Could you point me to the command lines to stop and start GUI? I am building quite an empire here

[prl]

Not Geoff, but:

init 4

to stop, and

init 3

to start.

[Trial_Master]

Thanks Peter. Excuse stupid question. But once I telnet to device I just run the command?

[Paul_oz53]

Thanks Peter. Excuse stupid question. But once I telnet to device I just run the command?

Since prl hasn't responded - yes. Necessary step when playing with files that are stored in memory to avoid changes being lost at shutdown.

No doubt prl can recite a dozen other times when these commands should be used.

[Trial_Master]

Thanks Paul.

[prl]

Thanks Peter. Excuse stupid question. But once I telnet to device I just run the command?

Since prl hasn't responded - yes. Necessary step when playing with files that are stored in memory to avoid changes being lost at shutdown.

No doubt prl can recite a dozen other times when these commands should be used.

Probably not that many. That one covers most of the cases where I use init 4/do stuff/init 3.

[Trial_Master]

Perfect. I have added Root password and enabled Telnet and have copied autotimer.xml

Thanks again for all of your assistance.

[Trial_Master]

Hello

I’ve noticed today, haven’t seen previously, I have duplicate timers for ABC News tonight, same for tomorrow night and Sunday night. In addition Pine Gap this Sunday also has duplicate timers now. All these shows are on ABC HD.

Any ideas?

EDIT: second timer for news tonight is finishing 1 minute later, Saturday news appears to be identical times, Sunday news is 1 minute longer and pine gap appears to be identical times.

[Grumpy_Geoff]

Have the timers been generated on both ABC HD and ABC (SD)? If so, you need to use a definition that either restricts to a service or to a bouquet that doesn't have the simulcasted services. I do the latter abd use my Favourites bouquet as it doesn't contain any simulcasted services (e.g. has Seven HD LCN 70 but not the simulcasted LCN 7 nor 71 services).

If not the above, and given your edit to the post since I first saw it it's probably not, then check the timer attributes by viewing the contents of file /etc/enigma2/timers.xml and see if the 'eit' value in each of the timers in question is the same or a different value. I'm thinking they'll be a different value. The start/finish times will be slightly different too (and not by "1 minute").

If you press INFO on each of the timers likely you'll see the new start time changes reflected.

Edit -
You don't need to telnet to the box to check the timer contents. You can also use OWIF and open the timer content in a browser tab - http://beyonwizt2/web/timerlist

[Trial_Master]

Hi Geoff

No, the timers were set up with ABC HD service filter, only some of the ABC News timers are doing this, they weren't duplicated yesterday when I last checked how my timers are progressing under Auto Timers.


The eit values and end time are indeed different


Example of tonight's ABC News

<e2timer>
<e2servicereference>1:0:19:245:241:1010:EEEE0000:0:0:0:</e2servicereference>
<e2servicename>ABC HD</e2servicename>
<e2eit>45593</e2eit>
<e2name>ABC News</e2name>
<e2description>The most detailed coverage of the day's events from Brisbane and across the state nightly at 7pm. ABC News Queensland presented by Matt Wordsworth (Mon-Thu) & Jessica van Vonderen (Fri-Sun). Plus weather with Jenny Woodward.</e2description>
<e2descriptionextended>N/A</e2descriptionextended>
<e2disabled>0</e2disabled>
<e2timebegin>1539334500</e2timebegin>
<e2timeend>1539338212</e2timeend>
<e2duration>3712</e2duration>
<e2startprepare>1539334480</e2startprepare>
<e2justplay>0</e2justplay>
<e2afterevent>3</e2afterevent>
<e2location>None</e2location>
<e2tags/>
<e2logentries>[(1538905193, 500, '[AutoTimer] Try to add new timer based on AutoTimer ABC News.'), (1538905193, 509, '[AutoTimer] Timer start on: Fri Oct 12 18:55:00 2018')]</e2logentries>
<e2filename/>
<e2backoff>0</e2backoff>
<e2nextactivation/>
<e2firsttryprepare>True</e2firsttryprepare>
<e2state>0</e2state>
<e2repeated>0</e2repeated>
<e2dontsave>0</e2dontsave>
<e2cancled>False</e2cancled>
<e2toggledisabled>1</e2toggledisabled>
<e2toggledisabledimg>off</e2toggledisabledimg>
<e2alwayszap>0</e2alwayszap>
</e2timer>
<e2timer>
<e2servicereference>1:0:19:245:241:1010:EEEE0000:0:0:0:</e2servicereference>
<e2servicename>ABC HD</e2servicename>
<e2eit>50</e2eit>
<e2name>ABC News</e2name>
<e2description>The most detailed coverage of the day's events from Brisbane and across the state nightly at 7pm. ABC News Queensland presented by Matt Wordsworth (Mon-Thu) & Jessica van Vonderen (Fri-Sun). Plus weather with Jenny Woodward.</e2description>
<e2descriptionextended>N/A</e2descriptionextended>
<e2disabled>0</e2disabled>
<e2timebegin>1539334500</e2timebegin>
<e2timeend>1539338222</e2timeend>
<e2duration>3722</e2duration>
<e2startprepare>1539334480</e2startprepare>
<e2justplay>0</e2justplay>
<e2afterevent>3</e2afterevent>
<e2location>None</e2location>
<e2tags/>
<e2logentries>[(1539235045, 500, '[AutoTimer] Try to add new timer based on AutoTimer ABC News.'), (1539235045, 509, '[AutoTimer] Timer start on: Fri Oct 12 18:55:00 2018')]</e2logentries>
<e2filename/>
<e2backoff>0</e2backoff>
<e2nextactivation/>
<e2firsttryprepare>True</e2firsttryprepare>
<e2state>0</e2state>
<e2repeated>0</e2repeated>
<e2dontsave>0</e2dontsave>
<e2cancled>False</e2cancled>
<e2toggledisabled>1</e2toggledisabled>
<e2toggledisabledimg>off</e2toggledisabledimg>
<e2alwayszap>0</e2alwayszap>
</e2timer>

[Grumpy_Geoff]

...The eit values and end time are indeed different

The EIT value is a "key" part of a timer, and the AutoTimer plugin will use the EIT value from an existing timer to find the "corresponding" EPG entry based on that EIT value to allow it to update any changed start/end times.
If the EPG EIT has changed and there's now nothing to match against then the plugin will leave the existing timer alone and generate a new timer.

There is a setting you can change that allows the AutoTimer plugin to match on time criteria if the EIT match fails. I'll get to that in a minute.

Now to your timer examples -
Yep, ten seconds difference in the duration (with same start time), and there was a new EPG EIT value issued for the program when the duration time changed.

To translate the Unix Epoch times (seconds past 00:00:00 1 Jan 1970 UTC) you can use a web converter such as https://www.epochconverter.com/ or use the command line -

Code: Select all

root@beyonwizu4:~# date --date='@1538905193'
Sun Oct  7 17:39:53 AWST 2018
root@beyonwizu4:~# date --date='@1539235045'
Thu Oct 11 13:17:25 AWST 2018
root@beyonwizu4:~#

Adding two hours from my results for your timezone, we can see that the second timer was generated at 11-Oct 15:17.

Delete the newer of the timer pairs. Then enable the AutoTimer setting 'Guess existing timer based on begin/end'. Then press GREEN/Save when back in the AutoTimer definitions list to force a parse of the definitions against the EPG. Wait until the result is displayed on the screen, then check the timers again and you should see the original timer updated and no second timer generated.
You'll be able to tell it was using the new setting for the timer update based upon time matches when the EIT no longer matches, with additional timer log entries of "[AutoTimer] Warning, AutoTimer {x} messed with a timer which might not belong to it: {y} .".

If the "Guess existing timer" setting is disabled (which is the default), then a timer will only be updated if the EIT matches both the timer and the EPG entry. If the EIT does not match, then a new timer is generated and the old timer is left as is.
If the setting is enabled then even if the EIT does not match, the timer will be updated as long as it is within a time window tolerance.

This wouldn't be an issue if the AutoTimer plugin removed timers that didn't have an EIT match in the EPG. There's a setting for it, but the code to action it is commented out.

[Trial_Master]

Thanks heaps Geoff. I will make those changes later today. Sounds like things would be simpler if that EIT match deletion feature was active, but I assume there are valid reasons for it being commented out.

These Auto Timers are working out well week 1. I might not return to ICE at this rate.

Appreciate your time, very helpful as always the team on these boards.

[Trial_Master]

Rereading the instructions it was a quick process so I have made the changes and everything is working as expected now.

Thanks again

[Trial_Master]

Geoff I was reviewing the AutoTimers - how to get started guide viewtopic.php?t=9641 to familiarise myself with the details on Guess existing timer on begin/end setting and I noticed the guide recommends to have this setting turned off. If you don’t mind could you explain why this setting removed duplicate timers but the guide is kinda saying the opposite in that when turned on it can cause large numbers of timers to be created when there should only be one. I’m just trying to understand the logic of the setting. No more duplicates since the change yesterday

[prl]

the details on Guess existing timer on begin/end setting and I noticed the guide recommends to have this setting turned off. If you don’t mind could you explain why this setting removed duplicate timers but the guide is kinda saying the opposite in that when turned on it can cause large numbers of timers to be created when there should only be one.

At the time that I wrote that guide, what I wrote there was correct, especially for programs where the program length was shorter than the total padding (e.g. for much of children's afternoon programming with a typical total padding of about 30min).

I wrote the guide at the time when IceTV went into administration, and its future looked uncertain. I tried preparing to use AutoTimers in its place in case the IceTV service never resumed, and the guide (which was originally "quick", but expanded well beyond its title description) was a result of my experiences with it at that time. My experience with AutoTimers at the time was enough for me to be happy to resume paying for IceTV when it resurfaced. Not everyone feels that way about AutoTimers.

It han't been updated much since, and doesn't cover configuring AutoTimers via Open Webif at all. It would probably be useful if someone who actually uses AutoTimers for their recording scheduling gave it a thorough editing, possibly a complete re-write, and extended it to cover the Open WebIf interface.

[Trial_Master]

Thanks Peter

Good to know. I would be happy to contribute to guide in the future, I am currently week 1 and far from understanding these Auto Timers. I have all my current airing shows faithfully working and the "looser" Auto Timers set up to capture shows returning. If things continue positively I personally see no need for Ice TV but I'll continue my experiment for much longer until I make a final call.

From a user prospective the options for the Auto Timers, albeit logical, are rather confusing. Maybe Beyonwiz could build a better wizard that defaults the best settings for recordings or at least somehow simplify the language? I don't know, I'm just thinking out loud, but it has been a little intensive to learn after being on Ice TV and I could see the average user running for the hills with Auto Timers. I like a challenge though so I'll stick with them until they cause me issues that can not be resolved.

[Grumpy_Geoff]

Geoff I was reviewing the AutoTimers - how to get started guide viewtopic.php?t=9641 to familiarise myself with the details on Guess existing timer on begin/end setting and I noticed the guide recommends to have this setting turned off. If you don’t mind could you explain why this setting removed duplicate timers but the guide is kinda saying the opposite in that when turned on it can cause large numbers of timers to be created when there should only be one. I’m just trying to understand the logic of the setting. No more duplicates since the change yesterday

That part of the FAQ states:
"Guess existing timer on begin/end when enabled, AutoTimers try to find existing timers for the AutoTimer from their begin/end time. This option works very poorly for programs that are short compared to the padding used. It's recommended that you turn this off, because it can cause large numbers of timers to be created when there should only be one.".

prl has already posted as to why he wrote that in the FAQ. I believe it was correct at the time, as I'd long ago disabled the setting when I had had issues.
Possibly prl thinks/thought the "try_guessing" time-matching method used is a bit agricultural.
Possibly now some later code changes no longer make that an issue.
Possibly it's still an issue that I've yet to come across; although I've been running with "try_guessing" enabled for about three months now, and I know the "short" programs I have as testers are having their EPG EITs replaced because currently in the timers file I can see there are seven "messed with" timers - that is, timers created from the original EPG program event and where that EPG event has now been replaced with a new event for that same program and that it now has different times or short description and a different EIT, and the AutoTimer plugin has used "time similarity" to match and update the existing timer instead of creating a new "duplicate" - with six of them being for my "short" test timers of:
Atomic Puppet (using my standard 7min pre-/23min post-padding/11-12min event duration) x 5 EIT changes
The Day Henry Met (a custom 5min before-/5min after-offset/5min event duration) x 1 EIT change
Other timers in the file for the same programs show that they've had their times changed when the EIT values have matched on an update, so it appears to be working in both cases.

I don't profess to know exactly what the "time similarity" code is doing (the use of it is at line 540) -

Code: Select all

if rtimer.eit == eit or (config.plugins.autotimer.try_guessing.getValue() and timeSimilarityPercent(rtimer, evtBegin, evtEnd, timer) > 80):

which I think is saying "if the EIT values in the existing timer and the EPG event match, _OR_ if there is a greater than 80% match between the timer and EPG program's time similarity, then proceed to see if there's an update needed"

[Trial_Master]

Hi Geoff

When you refer to Timers File and "messed" with timers. Could you enlighten me on how I can keep an eye on my setup? I had a look at my timers.xml but it's a very busy and detailed file

[prl]

Last time I looked it meant either matching EIT ids or if config.plugins.autotimer.try_guessing was enabled, 80% or greater overlap of the full padded time span of the timer and the unpadded time span of the candidate EPG entry as a percentage of the latter. You can see how that could run into difficulties with short programs and relatively long padding.

When I looked at it, timeSimilarityPercent() was possibly the most convoluted code I've ever seen for the "intersection of two intervals" problem, though, IIRC, correct as far as it goes. The problem at the time related what overlap was being calculated, rather than whether the calculation was right.

I'm not sure why they just didn't use min(a.end, b.end) - max(a.start, b.start) (0 or negative is no overlap), or for a percentage, 100 * (min(a.end, b.end) - max(a.start, b.start)) / (a.end - a.start). Perhaps they do now.

[Grumpy_Geoff]

Hi Geoff

When you refer to Timers File and "messed" with timers. Could you enlighten me on how I can keep an eye on my setup? I had a look at my timers.xml but it's a very busy and detailed file

As per -

...You'll be able to tell it was using the new setting for the timer update based upon time matches when the EIT no longer matches, with additional timer log entries of "[AutoTimer] Warning, AutoTimer {x} messed with a timer which might not belong to it: {y} .".

In the OWIF 'timerlist' display -

Code: Select all

<e2logentries>
[(1538814480, 500, '[AutoTimer] Try to add new timer based on AutoTimer test - Atomic Puppet.'),
 (1538814480, 509, '[AutoTimer] Timer start on: Sun Oct 14 07:03:30 2018'),
 (1539133341, 15, 'record time changed, start prepare is now: Sun Oct 14 07:03:12 2018'),
 (1539381020, 501, '[AutoTimer] Warning, AutoTimer test - Atomic Puppet messed with a timer which might not belong to it: Atomic Puppet .'),
 (1539381020, 15, 'record time changed, start prepare is now: Sun Oct 14 07:03:02 2018')
]
</e2logentries>

or in the UI's timer log -

[Trial_Master]

Thanks Geoff

I'll take a look in Auto Timer to find the Logs.

[Grumpy_Geoff]

Last time I looked it meant either matching EIT ids or if config.plugins.autotimer.try_guessing was enabled, 80% or greater overlap of the full padded time span of the timer and the unpadded time span of the candidate EPG entry as a percentage of the latter. You can see how that could run into difficulties with short programs and relatively long padding.

Yep, sure. It appears to me (amateur view) that timeSimilarityPercent (at least now) removes the padding before the comparison occurs.

When I looked at it, timeSimilarityPercent() was possibly the most convoluted code I've ever seen for the "intersection of two intervals" problem, though, IIRC, correct as far as it goes. The problem at the time related what overlap was being calculated, rather than whether the calculation was right.

I'm not sure why they just didn't use min(a.end, b.end) - max(a.start, b.start) (0 or negative is no overlap), or for a percentage, 100 * (min(a.end, b.end) - max(a.start, b.start)) / (a.end - a.start). Perhaps they do now.

I don't know if the time similarity code has been refined, didn't you suggest a change at one time (clickety-click, found it )?
These changes in 2016 are possibly responsible for its better behaviour -
https://github.com/oe-alliance/enigma2- ... 49afc17764
https://github.com/oe-alliance/enigma2- ... 49afc17764

All I've go to go on is the much better timer behaviour since I re-enabled "try_guessing" on 20-Jul. A search of the debug logs shows that the plugin has updated an existing timer 56 times since then, instead of creating a duplicate.

[Trial_Master]

Where is the UI Timer Log? I only see the following options?

[Grumpy_Geoff]

Where is the UI Timer Log? I only see the following options? ui.png

Press INFO on each timer in the Timer List screen

[Trial_Master]

Where is the UI Timer Log? I only see the following options? ui.png

Press INFO on each timer in the Timer List screen

Sorry Geoff I must have missed this. I tried the INFO button but it appears to take me to the Timer Entry window. There are only two options Cancel and Ok?

[prl]

Where is the UI Timer Log? I only see the following options? ui.png

Press INFO on each timer in the Timer List screen

Sorry Geoff I must have missed this. I tried the INFO button but it appears to take me to the Timer Entry window. There are only two options Cancel and Ok?

I'm not sure where you're looking. TIMER from live TV has Delete, Add & Disable on the coloured button hints, and an INFO hint in the bottom bar, and MENU>AutoTimer from live TV has Close, Save, Delete & Add on the coloured button hints, and MENU and HELP hints in the bottom bar.

From live TV, what Grumpy_Geoff is suggesting is: TIMER, navigate to the timer, INFO to see that timer's log info.

There is no logging information available in the AutoTimer interface, MENU>AutoTimer from live TV. The only logging that AutoTimer does that's visible through the UI is into the timers that it generates, which can be viewed as above.

[Trial_Master]

Hi Peter

I will double check this evening, but I was looking at "TIMER, navigate to the timer, INFO". When I pressed INFO it took me to a page titled Timer Entry. I could edit the details of the Timer but not see any log related to it? What am I doing wrong here?

[Trial_Master]

Hi All

I'll keep this question separate.

With relation to the new TEN channel naming, will this impact any Auto Timers I have set up for a selected Service or boutique?

[Grumpy_Geoff]

Hi Peter

I will double check this evening, but I was looking at "TIMER, navigate to the timer, INFO". When I pressed INFO it took me to a page titled Timer Entry. I could edit the details of the Timer but not see any log related to it? What am I doing wrong here?

[Trial_Master]

Thanks Geoff. I think I know what is going on now but how to resolve is the question.

I use a Harmony Elite remote and when push the INFO button it is not opening the Log page. I just connected to T4 via VPN and when using the remote within OpenWebif it worked as you described.

I'll need to check what the mapping on Harmony is for INFO.

Thanks for the screenshots, I should of twigged to this earlier and tried with original remote. Lesson learnt.

[MrQuade]

I'll need to check what the mapping on Harmony is for INFO.

By default, the Harmony INFO button is mapped to the INFO command, so it must be the result of a custom re-mapping that you made at some point and have forgotten.

[Trial_Master]

Love Technology. I just used Harmony app on my phone to look at mapping. You are right I had it set to OK so that when watching Live TV it just has the current show and Next Show details along bottom of screen. If I push again I get a more detailed description. I'll likely leave that as is so as not to confuse the family, but I have changed the Long Press of INFO to the default mapping.

Thanks again everyone. Another case closed! I'm still having a good run with Auto Timers. I even have the equivalent of Keyword Recording working. Very happy thus far, and at this point in time I don't see a return to ICE required. More money saved

[prl]

I'll need to check what the mapping on Harmony is for INFO.

By default, the Harmony INFO button is mapped to the INFO command, so it must be the result of a custom re-mapping that you made at some point and have forgotten.

As far as I can tell, only the KEY_OK code will open the Timer Edit screen from the timer list, so my guess is that Trial_Master has mapped the INFO button on the Harmony to KEY_OK.

When instructions are given about key presses, they almost always refer to the Beyonwiz remotes unless stated otherwise. I also avoid using buttons that are only on the U4 remote, even when I'm replying to a U4 user (i.e. say MENU>Setup rather that SETUP) so that the suggestion will work for users with a similar problem on a different model.

It's not really possible to give instructions about which buttons to press on an unknown model of an unknown remote brand with unknown keycode mappings.

[Grumpy_Geoff]

Hi All

I'll keep this question separate.

With relation to the new TEN channel naming, will this impact any Auto Timers I have set up for a selected Service or boutique?

No action needed as your AutoTimer definitions will be using a bouquet reference or service reference - the service names are not used in the definition.
For example -

Code: Select all

 <timer name="SEAL Team" match="SEAL Team" enabled="yes" avoidDuplicateDescription="2" overrideAlternatives="1">
  <bouquet>1:7:1:0:0:0:0:0:0:0:FROM BOUQUET "userbouquet.favourites.tv" ORDER BY bouquet</bouquet> <!-- Favourites (TV) -->
  <exclude where="title">Encore</exclude>
 </timer>

 <timer name="Hawaii Five-O" match="Hawaii Five-O" enabled="yes" avoidDuplicateDescription="1" overrideAlternatives="1">
  <serviceref>1:0:19:684:607:1014:EEEE0000:0:0:0:</serviceref> <!-- TEN HD -->
 </timer>

...and it's not boutique

[Trial_Master]

I'll need to check what the mapping on Harmony is for INFO.

By default, the Harmony INFO button is mapped to the INFO command, so it must be the result of a custom re-mapping that you made at some point and have forgotten.

As far as I can tell, only the KEY_OK code will open the Timer Edit screen from the timer list, so my guess is that Trial_Master has mapped the INFO button on the Harmony to KEY_OK.

When instructions are given about key presses, they almost always refer to the Beyonwiz remotes unless stated otherwise. I also avoid using buttons that are only on the U4 remote, even when I'm replying to a U4 user (i.e. say MENU>Setup rather that SETUP) so that the suggestion will work for users with a similar problem on a different model.

It's not really possible to give instructions about which buttons to press on an unknown model of an unknown remote brand with unknown keycode mappings.

Thanks Pete. All on me, I should have at least mentioned the Harmony remote was in the mix. Noted for myself next time before raising questions here. Appreciate everyone's time, and sorry for wasting it.

[Trial_Master]

Hi All

I'll keep this question separate.

With relation to the new TEN channel naming, will this impact any Auto Timers I have set up for a selected Service or boutique?

No action needed as your AutoTimer definitions will be using a bouquet reference or service reference - the service names are not used in the definition.
For example -

Code: Select all

 <timer name="SEAL Team" match="SEAL Team" enabled="yes" avoidDuplicateDescription="2" overrideAlternatives="1">
  <bouquet>1:7:1:0:0:0:0:0:0:0:FROM BOUQUET "userbouquet.favourites.tv" ORDER BY bouquet</bouquet> <!-- Favourites (TV) -->
  <exclude where="title">Encore</exclude>
 </timer>

 <timer name="Hawaii Five-O" match="Hawaii Five-O" enabled="yes" avoidDuplicateDescription="1" overrideAlternatives="1">
  <serviceref>1:0:19:684:607:1014:EEEE0000:0:0:0:</serviceref> <!-- TEN HD -->
 </timer>

...and it's not boutique

Thanks Geoff

I'm really on fire today. May be time for another coffee

[MrQuade]

Love Technology. I just used Harmony app on my phone to look at mapping. You are right I had it set to OK so that when watching Live TV it just has the current show and Next Show details along bottom of screen. If I push again I get a more detailed description. I'll likely leave that as is so as not to confuse the family, but I have changed the Long Press of INFO to the default mapping.

There is a feature request in the bug tracker to have the INFO button act a little more sensibly, though the discussion got bogged down when I overstepped myself by requesting some (in hindsight) silly additions. I think that this feature request would definitely help to make the INFO button more useful when invoked from Live TV, and make it function more like every other PVR and TV interface on the market.

Issue #407 called for changing the INFO button so that pressing the INFO button when in the Event Info screen would dismiss the Event Info screen.

I still see value in changing this basic behaviour, but all the other noise about remapping functions to the colour buttons is not really required.

Hehe, I had even more grand plans once upon a time for the the INFO button when invoked from Live TV, but that would have been a much bigger battle and not worth the hassle .

[Trial_Master]

There is a feature request in the bug tracker to have the INFO button act a little more sensibly, though the discussion got bogged down when I overstepped myself by requesting some (in hindsight) silly additions. I think that this feature request would definitely help to make the INFO button more useful when invoked from Live TV, and make it function more like every other PVR and TV interface on the market.

Issue #407 called for changing the INFO button so that pressing the INFO button when in the Event Info screen would dismiss the Event Info screen.

I still see value in changing this basic behaviour, but all the other noise about remapping functions to the colour buttons is not really required.

Hehe, I had even more grand plans once upon a time for the the INFO button when invoked from Live TV, but that would have been a much bigger battle and not worth the hassle .

Good info to know. I didn't like the default INFO screen when accessing from Live TV. I must have changed that when I first got my T4, hence I forgot I had changed the mapping.

[prl]

In live TV, the INFO button is user-configurable and is really an "alternative EPG button". In that context (and in viewing recordings or media), remapping it on the Harmony to be KEY_OK makes some sense. But doing that interferes with the use of the KEY_INFO code in other contexts (like the timer list).

[Trial_Master]

I don't really use INFO apart from discussed, so it may well be an issue for other uses. When I see the INFO selection from now I will try both OK and INFO to see if i've been missing out on other screens like the Timer Logs.