NAS access

[Paul_oz53]

OK so I've found the way to make my IP addresses static. Netgear in their wisdom changed the menu and took it out of advanced setup and put it under LAN setup GRRRR Anyway that is now done. Remounted the NAS, entered the login details User name & password (and yes I verified they are correct) got the confirmation of the mount then went to media expanded the NAS the expanded the Share and it tells me the folder does not exist just like before. Just in case you are wondering, yes there are files in that folder/directory. Without understanding what IS actually happening, it tells ME it can't see the directory and therefore thinks it doesn't exist. This makes me wonder if it actually logged in to the NAS. It gave no indication if it did or not so I can only assume..... dumb move. So, is it possible that it's a login issue to the NAS and the U4 just isn't telling me?

Sometimes the U4 gets out of sync with my shares if something has been rebooted or wasn't on when it last checked, etc. I force a remount when that happens. Also, if you need to change the credentials if they are wrong use: Menu>Setup>Network>Mount manager>Mountpoints management.

Select the folder on the NAS you are trying to access and make sure the username and password fields are correct. You shouldn't need to touch anything else but check the Server IP address is correct, or fix it if it is not the address you reserved for the NAS. Ditto the Server share name is critical. At this stage, I wouldn't delete the mount - just edit it and then remount it, even if it is showing as a green tick.

If no username/password is required by the folder, these fields should be blank. Otherwise, scroll down to the password field to see what it has stored for the password.

Even if you change nothing, press GREEN to save and select Yes when it asks if you want to use the new settings. This forces a remount of the folder (for me, all my available folders even if I hadn't selected them). Be patient, it's often quite slow to respond.

Try Media>Location again. Now if it still hasn't found the share, we really are getting into new territory! We may have to flush out the network files Grumpy_Geoff mentioned to clear a mismatch.

[Moparmartin]

I had no idea you could even set a user name and password for folders so I don't have any set. Now tell me this is why it's all turned to $h?t*. I'm rapidly getting to the point where I no longer give a damn what this wiz bang machine can accomplish. It would appear I'm certainly not smart enough to to use it. It would be far easier just to buy a bigger hard drive and ignore it all. 1080p works fine for me and I don't need to connect my NAS. I'm just pissed off that a company makes claims about it's product, but for what ever reason it's impossible to access those facilities. As a customer I EXPECT to be either able to set up the product OR be given customer support to achieve that goal. I do not think it's fair that you guys on a forum should have to carry the can. How many days has this been going and I still can't connect the thing to a NAS, nor has there been any progress at all. How hard can it be. Obviously way beyond all of us. Quite simply this situation is unacceptable. This is looking to me like Beyonwiz are not prepared to finance adequate customer support because it's so much cheaper to get a forum to volunteer time to assist people like me. Like most people, I have a life other than wrestling with this type of problem and in reality it is the responsibility of the manufacturer to ensure the product meets their claims. I am just so disappointed. What else can I say? Name any other class of product where this is acceptable. I don't expect perfection but this is not acceptable. I see that it may not be a faulty unit but they have no right to make claims without providing support to achieve integration with other equipment then fail to support the customer. Lots of time and headaches with nothing to show. I'm over it!

[MrQuade]

It ok, and not time for dispair. You just have one of those issues that is to result of many factors. When you have one problem with several causes, it always looks like a complete cluster. We just have to resolve them one at a time.

Please be assured though, this normally just works for most users. Now that the IP address issue is resolved, this should get better pretty quickly.


As for ongoing solutions...
Do you provide a user name and password for that share when you access it with your PC? If not, then you shouldn't even need to provide one when mounting the share with the U4.

[Grumpy_Geoff]

...Do you provide a user name and password for that share when you access it with your PC? If not, then you shouldn't even need to provide one when mounting the share with the U4.

Has it ever been mentioned that Martin accesses the NAS from anything (PC, TV, media player, et. al.) using SMB/CIFS/Windows sharing? I don't think so.
It could be using DLNA as far as we know.

[prl]

I had no idea you could even set a user name and password for folders so I don't have any set. Now tell me this is why it's all turned to $h?t*. I'm rapidly getting to the point where I no longer give a damn what this wiz bang machine can accomplish. It would appear I'm certainly not smart enough to to use it. It would be far easier just to buy a bigger hard drive and ignore it all. 1080p works fine for me and I don't need to connect my NAS. I'm just pissed off that a company makes claims about it's product, but for what ever reason it's impossible to access those facilities. As a customer I EXPECT to be either able to set up the product OR be given customer support to achieve that goal. I do not think it's fair that you guys on a forum should have to carry the can. How many days has this been going and I still can't connect the thing to a NAS, nor has there been any progress at all. How hard can it be. Obviously way beyond all of us. Quite simply this situation is unacceptable. This is looking to me like Beyonwiz are not prepared to finance adequate customer support because it's so much cheaper to get a forum to volunteer time to assist people like me. Like most people, I have a life other than wrestling with this type of problem and in reality it is the responsibility of the manufacturer to ensure the product meets their claims. I am just so disappointed. What else can I say? Name any other class of product where this is acceptable. I don't expect perfection but this is not acceptable. I see that it may not be a faulty unit but they have no right to make claims without providing support to achieve integration with other equipment then fail to support the customer. Lots of time and headaches with nothing to show. I'm over it!

When I'm confronted with a wall of text like that, my inclination is to just move on. Please do your readers a favour and use paragraphs.

If you want manufacturer support, call them.

[Paul_oz53]

I had no idea you could even set a user name and password for folders so I don't have any set. Now tell me this is why it's all turned to $h?t*. I'm rapidly getting to the point where I no longer give a damn what this wiz bang machine can accomplish. It would appear I'm certainly not smart enough to to use it. It would be far easier just to buy a bigger hard drive and ignore it all. 1080p works fine for me and I don't need to connect my NAS. I'm just pissed off that a company makes claims about it's product, but for what ever reason it's impossible to access those facilities. As a customer I EXPECT to be either able to set up the product OR be given customer support to achieve that goal. I do not think it's fair that you guys on a forum should have to carry the can. How many days has this been going and I still can't connect the thing to a NAS, nor has there been any progress at all. How hard can it be. Obviously way beyond all of us. Quite simply this situation is unacceptable. This is looking to me like Beyonwiz are not prepared to finance adequate customer support because it's so much cheaper to get a forum to volunteer time to assist people like me. Like most people, I have a life other than wrestling with this type of problem and in reality it is the responsibility of the manufacturer to ensure the product meets their claims. I am just so disappointed. What else can I say? Name any other class of product where this is acceptable. I don't expect perfection but this is not acceptable. I see that it may not be a faulty unit but they have no right to make claims without providing support to achieve integration with other equipment then fail to support the customer. Lots of time and headaches with nothing to show. I'm over it!

Hi Martin,

I appreciate your frustration but, as MrQuade has said, we are trying to solve your problem, one step at a time. Somewhere in your network chain there may be a setting that is wrong. One wrong setting is all it takes. The moment it is corrected joy of joys! It works. We are trying to help you find that setting. But there are a lot of them to check.

Beyonwiz Australia is a small company and doesn't have the resources of a major corporation to support it but it does have support available. You can lodge a support ticket and they will contact you. It also has us, a loyal band of fans willing to share our knowledge. And we don't give up easily. Generally, we can respond more quickly and conveniently than a 9-5 office based service. From our collective experience, we are rarely defeated by a problem. When a bug is found we have a brilliant set of resources who go out of their way to fix it as quickly as is humanly possible.

In your case, so far we have found that your modem may be flaky but, after a struggle, it seems that you have tamed it. Any advice I offer is based on experience gained sorting out my own network. Along the way, I have gathered a lot of experience in how to stuff things up with wrong choices. I started when we used to setup mounts manually. Now they're semi-automatic. The U4 certainly can connect to NAS's. There are dozens out there that are correctly configured that work seamlessly. My home network is pretty complicated and it all works just fine. I routinely record multiple channels to multiple locations and watch programs on other devices via the T3, T4 or U4 with no problems beyond errors in the program guide and occasional crappy reception.

For all the discussion to date, you have not told us very much about your network, your firmware or your NAS and how you are actually using it. We have been assuming that the NAS access is via a Samba network or similar, not DLNA. Now we know you don't use a username and password to access a NAS folder from a PC (am I right?) there is a good chance that is the current problem to correct.

In my previous post are detailed instructions for making sure a shared mount is correctly setup in Mountmanager. If you have the correct details in Mountmanager, it should work after you mount or remount that share. The preferred settings for a Samba share with no password set are:

1. Mount using: autofs
2. Active
3. Local share name: a unique name
4. Mount type: CIFS share
5. Server IP: the NAS IP address
6. Server share name: the folder you want to access
7. Use as HDD replacement: off
8. Mount options: rw, UTF-8
9. Username blank
10. Password blank

Notice here the NAS IP address is critical. If it changes, the mount is instantly lost. This is why we asked you to be sure to set a static IP for the NAS.

If it is not working after the entry for your NAS is made correct, a potential problem is auto.network not matching automounts.xml. One of my early problems was due to this mismatch. One reason we suggest a firmware flash and clean setup is that these two files are restored to the empty state. Restoring settings will restore a corrupted version of these files. Grumpy_Geoff has given you advice on how to clean up those files as noted in my earlier post.

Writing long posts with no punctuation may be cathartic for you but it doesn't help us unravel your problem and offer considered advice. It really helps us if you write short, factual sentences organised into paragraphs.

My day job is in enforcing consumer rights so I probably know more about consumer law, truth in advertising, consumer rights and the tricks of industry to avoid their obligations than you might expect. What I will say is that Beyonwiz is not a firm that I consider to be unethical.

[Moparmartin]

Point taken, but this process is showing no sign of progress. Yes you are correct that I have not fully answered your questions in precise terms. This is because I'm getting lost with most of it trying to assign the tasks in my head to the overall process. I then go off and research as much as possible so I don't appear totally stupid, then I get another specific question and I'm back to more research.

I will now attempt to verify ALL the question asked of me so that means trawling all the replies. In the mean time this is what I know and what I believe to date. From my point of view and based on my knowledge the goal is to tell the U4 to look at the NAS, which it sees as an entity on the network by default. I assume the "mount" tells the U4 to look at the contents of the NAS which requires the login credentials. I have now gone through this process several times without success. The U4 confirms the mount. If I then go to Media --> Autofs --> NAS and the NAS is off it will not go any further but with the NAS powered up it reports that Directory "media/autofs/NAS" does not exist. I may be missing something here but that suggests to me the U4 is not seeing the mount that it reported as being successful. Either that or the mount process should have created the directory but failed.

Details aside, during this process my NAS lost it's address several times after a demount, but it always regained the same address of 192.168.0.10 though sometime prior to purchasing the U4 it did change from 11. However, as reported I have now set the router for my NAS, U4 and receiver to static. Logically at his point I would be more interested in delving into confirming what should have been achieved in the mount process and what actually happened, because clearly it's looking for a directory it expects to exist. This points the finger at the mount and anything that may have had an adverse effect in the process. Either way the U4 has erroneously confirmed a successful mount.

With respect to my upscale sound loss, further investigations reveal the TV (Panasonic TH-55DX600U) documentation doesn't show any upscale ability nor does my Yamaha RX-V681 receiver. The receiver has a 4K pass through with an auto mode for switching 4:4:4 or 4:2:2 or 4:2:0 and a manual mode of 4:2:0 only. Therefore the only device capable of up scaling is the U4. Something I have noticed is that even though the U4 is set to 1080p, the TV reports the U4 splash screen as 2160 then drops to 1080p with the U4 tuner output. This too suggests the 4K pathway is open from the U4 to the TV. Again this points to the fault being in the U4.

I will now attempt to go through all the other questions and report back

[MrQuade]

With respect to my upscale sound loss, further investigations reveal the TV (Panasonic TH-55DX600U) documentation doesn't show any upscale ability nor does my Yamaha RX-V681 receiver. The receiver has a 4K pass through with an auto mode for switching 4:4:4 or 4:2:2 or 4:2:0 and a manual mode of 4:2:0 only. Therefore the only device capable of up scaling is the U4. Something I have noticed is that even though the U4 is set to 1080p, the TV reports the U4 splash screen as 2160 then drops to 1080p with the U4 tuner output. This too suggests the 4K pathway is open from the U4 to the TV. Again this points to the fault being in the U4.

I think you are still getting confused about upscaling in general.

You have a 4K TV, and by it very nature, always needs to drive all of those 4k pixels in order to fill up the screen with a picture. If the TV receives a 1080p signal, then it *must* upscale the picture in order to make it fit the 4K screen. The TV is *always* capable of upscaling an incoming signal to its native resolution, and PeterU's earlier point was that modern TVs will generally do a good job of this. You are not going to get any appreciable benefit in having the U4 or the receiver do this job instead.

Now putting the NAS issue aside for a moment, to solve the sound issue, I think you need to perform some diagnostic steps first. The first step is to simplify your connection to the TV.
I'd advise that you bypass the amplifier for a moment, and plug the U4 directly into the TV. Set up the TV to play audio through its own speakers, and verify that the U4 still works with sound in 1080p mode. Now switch the U4 up to 2160p mode, while still plugged directly into the TV, and see what happens to the sound. If you still have sound, then you know that the receiver may be in the wrong here. If you don't have any sound, then you can more confidently claim that there is a fault with the U4.

[Moparmartin]

Reply to Paul,
In response to your points you wrote...... plus my answers in bold

In my previous post are detailed instructions for making sure a shared mount is correctly setup in Mountmanager. If you have the correct details in Mountmanager, it should work after you mount or remount that share. The preferred settings with no password set are:

Mount using: autofs Autofs mounted as needed
Active Yes
Local share name: a unique name Yes, it's the name of my NAS
Mount type: CIFS share NO it says NFS share
Server IP: the NAS IP address 192.168.0.10 which is correct
Server share name: the folder you want to access YES
Use as HDD replacement: off OFF
Mount options: rw, UTF-8 NO it says "rw,nolock,tcp"
Username blank Not on list
Password blank Not on list

So the mount type appears to be wrong and so too do the mount options. My question at this point is why the mismatch and how did the U4 do something different to what you expected. Furthermore, what can I do to fix this issue?

Additionally, the only thing I've done today is to attempt to access the content on the NAS via Media/autofs/ etc and my NAS has been stripped of it's IP address again. Just tried to replicate the loss of address and It has no effect. So could this mismatch be the entire problem of not being able to access the NAS? If it is, then I would suggest that this semi auto mount process is not functioning correctly and I need to ask what's so different about this particular U4 or is it just the latest firmware? Has anyone else attempted this with the current firmware or have all the known NAS connections been initiated using earlier firmware? Alternately it could be a nasty glitch in the NAS which is a Netgear RN10400 4 bay model with the current firmware as of about 6 months ago.

[MrQuade]

Mount type: CIFS share NO it says NFS share

So the mount type appears to be wrong and so too do the mount options. My question at this point is why the mismatch and how did the U4 do something different to what you expected. Furthermore, what can I do to fix this issue?

The problem here may be the fact that you are trying to connect to the share with NFS. This type of connection is a fairly low-level, generally Unix'y thing, and it is possible that your NAS is not handling it well. A Windows PC for example will use a SMB/CIFS connection to talk to a NAS, and would be the more common type of connection you would see in day to day usage. In fact, a Windows workstation will typically not even be capable of connecting to a NFS share, so this is something you may not have encountered before.

It is possible that your NAS's NFS implementation is not all that stable if it is a device that is geared towards your average consumer.

When you open the list of shares to your NAS, you will more than likely see the share name listed twice, once with a NFS icon and once with a CIFS icon. You can try instead connecting to the CIFS one and see if you get any further.

I have a QNAP NAS at home which offers both NFS and SMB/CIFS shares. I choose to use NFS to connect from my U4 to the NAS, only because it is slightly less resource intensive than the alternative. All my Windows and Apple PCs connect to the NAS using SMB/CIFS.

Additionally, the only thing I've done today is to attempt to access the content on the NAS via Media/autofs/ etc and my NAS has been stripped of it's IP address again. Just tried to replicate the loss of address and It has no effect. So could this mismatch be the entire problem of not being able to access the NAS? If it is, then I would suggest that this semi auto mount process is not functioning correctly and I need to ask what's so different about this particular U4 or is it just the latest firmware? Has anyone else attempted this with the current firmware or have all the known NAS connections been initiated using earlier firmware? Alternately it could be a nasty glitch in the NAS which is a Netgear RN10400 4 bay model with the current firmware as of about 6 months ago.

I suspect a NAS glitch in this instance. If the NAS has a static IP, and is losing it, means that something is crashing in the NAS itself.
Now, I understand that you are setting the NAS's static IP in the router now? As an alternative experiment, you can try setting the NAS's IP address within the NAS's own configuration screens. This way, the NAS does not rely on any external device in order to determine its own IP.
I don't think this will necessarily solve any of your problems, but it may be interesting to see how the NAS recovers from the apparent crashes.

[sub3R]

... Server IP: the NAS IP address 192.168.0.10 ...
...
... and my NAS has been stripped of it's IP address again ...

In addition to MrQuade’s suggestions, I believe that address is too low in the pool range & your router is allocating that IP address to another device. See my post here & some of my following posts.

In the manual that I have downloaded for a router that is a similar model to yours, it states that the address pool range is from 192.168.0.2 to 192.168.0.254. Ideally you should set a fixed IP address above that range, but I found with mine (a different brand/model to yours) it wouldn’t allow that. So I reserved the IP addresses that I didn’t want to change high up in the pool.

So I suggest to try & set your NAS’s fixed IP address above the pool range. If the router won’t allow this, then set/reserve it high up in the pool range, to something like 192.168.0.150.

[Moparmartin]

OK I've checked the NAS and in order to to manually set the IP address it has to be done in the initial set up. Obviously that means setting up from scratch which would require my tech to do that at my cost. Given that it doesn't appear critical, is that worth it? With the NAS connected it telling me the directory doesn't exist so I would have thought that's the clue. I'd be chasing that as a starting point but I don't know enough to do that. Regarding shares the NAS makes no mention of SMB CFIS only SMB.

As for setting a higher address in the Router, it tells me the DHCP range as 10 to 209. I tried to set a higher address and got an error message saying I had to use an address within the DHCP range. However, yesterday I set the addresses for the the U4, the NAS and my Receiver to static so that must be Netgear's solution. I don't know what else to do now.

[MrQuade]

OK I've checked the NAS and in order to to manually set the IP address it has to be done in the initial set up. Obviously that means setting up from scratch which would require my tech to do that at my cost.

Don't worry too much about that then, it was just a suggestion for curiosity's sake. I am surprised that the address can't be set manually post-initial setup, but I will have to trust you on that one.

Given that it doesn't appear critical, is that worth it? With the NAS connected it telling me the directory doesn't exist so I would have thought that's the clue. I'd be chasing that as a starting point but I don't know enough to do that. Regarding shares the NAS makes no mention of SMB CFIS only SMB.

SMB then. CIFS and SMB are two terms that often get used interchangeably to mean the same thing (though they don't *actually* mean exactly the same thing). The NAS offers SMB shares, so I would advise you to use those rather than the NFS ones.

As for setting a higher address in the Router, it tells me the DHCP range as 10 to 209. I tried to set a higher address and got an error message saying I had to use an address within the DHCP range. However, yesterday I set the addresses for the the U4, the NAS and my Receiver to static so that must be Netgear's solution. I don't know what else to do now.

sub3R is suggesting that you set the NAS's address to a high value that is still within the DHCP lease range. So set it to 192.168.0.150, or 192.168.0.200 or something like that. You said earlier you had set the NAS to use 192.168.0.10 which is the very low in the range.

[Paul_oz53]

Reply to Paul,
In response to your points you wrote...... plus my answers in bold

In my previous post are detailed instructions for making sure a shared mount is correctly setup in Mountmanager. If you have the correct details in Mountmanager, it should work after you mount or remount that share. The preferred settings with no password set are:

Mount using: autofs Autofs mounted as needed
Active Yes
Local share name: a unique name Yes, it's the name of my NAS
Mount type: CIFS share NO it says NFS share
Server IP: the NAS IP address 192.168.0.10 which is correct
Server share name: the folder you want to access YES
Use as HDD replacement: off OFF
Mount options: rw, UTF-8 NO it says "rw,nolock,tcp"
Username blank Not on list
Password blank Not on list

So the mount type appears to be wrong and so too do the mount options. My question at this point is why the mismatch and how did the U4 do something different to what you expected. Furthermore, what can I do to fix this issue?

Additionally, the only thing I've done today is to attempt to access the content on the NAS via Media/autofs/ etc and my NAS has been stripped of it's IP address again. Just tried to replicate the loss of address and It has no effect. So could this mismatch be the entire problem of not being able to access the NAS? If it is, then I would suggest that this semi auto mount process is not functioning correctly and I need to ask what's so different about this particular U4 or is it just the latest firmware? Has anyone else attempted this with the current firmware or have all the known NAS connections been initiated using earlier firmware? Alternately it could be a nasty glitch in the NAS which is a Netgear RN10400 4 bay model with the current firmware as of about 6 months ago.

Aah, so the Network Browser thinks its an NFS share. I always use Samba/CIFS. I never use NFS so I can't help with the finer details but MrQuade will know. [Edited to remove an error and adopt MrQuade's recommendation.]

The alternative is to use Mountmanager and either: delete the share and remake it as MrQuade recommends; or, use it to edit the mount. Editing generally works ok but it will not fix all errors, esp. if the mismatch in the two files we mentioned earlier happens.

If editing, change the NFS to CIFS (scroll down to NFS and press right or left).

The username and password will now be visible. For the first attempt, leave these fields as they are. If they are empty, leave them empty. The default for a guest account is empty and no password. I have set passwords on my guest account so I actually use "guest" (no quotes) and the password. If not empty, check they match the credentials you use to login to the NAS. If this doesn't work, try again but next time add the username and password or delete the username and password.

Next, scroll to Mount options and press right to enter the field. Use PREV as backspace or NEXT as delete and the number keys as the SMS keyboard to change it to rw, utf8. GREEN save settings, then YES and wait for it to remount. Test.

Hopefully, the saga ends here.

[MrQuade]

Aah, so the Network Browser thinks its an NFS share. I always use Samba/CIFS. I never use NFS so I can't help with the finer details but for NFS to work on a U4, you have to install the NFS client. It's not in the base firmware. To install: Menu>Setup>Network>NFS. Not sure if it has any setup requirements but MrQuade will know. You should restart the GUI or reboot after doing that. Hopefully, that will work.

There should be no need for this, the NFS client comes built in to the firmware. The NFS component that requires installation is the NFS server, and he doesn't need this for NFS to operate.

The alternative is to use Mountmanager and change the NFS to CIFS (scroll down to NFS and press right or left).

I would strongly urge Moparmartin to not edit the existing mountpoint. Rather delete the existing mountpoint entirely, and then set it up again using the network browser. Some of the mount options are different between NFS and SMB, and it is just easier to set it up again from scratch.

Use network browser, click on the NAS. It sounds like you don't even need to enter a username and password at this point since I suspect the share is not password protected. The list of shares should be listed. There should be an NFS and SMB share with the the same name. Click on the SMB share, and again don't enter a username and password. All that needs to be done from there is to just save the mount with the default settings as provided.

If you run into trouble by not providing a username and password, then you can try the procedure again, but provide a valid username and password that has been configured for that share in your NAS. It is possible that your tech has configured a username and password on that share that matches your Windows username and password for you?

[Paul_oz53]

Aah, so the Network Browser thinks its an NFS share. I always use Samba/CIFS. I never use NFS so I can't help with the finer details but for NFS to work on a U4, you have to install the NFS client. It's not in the base firmware. To install: Menu>Setup>Network>NFS. Not sure if it has any setup requirements but MrQuade will know. You should restart the GUI or reboot after doing that. Hopefully, that will work.

There should be no need for this, the NFS client comes built in to the firmware. The NFS component that requires installation is the NFS server, and he doesn't need this for NFS to operate.

The alternative is to use Mountmanager and change the NFS to CIFS (scroll down to NFS and press right or left).

I would strongly urge Moparmartin to not edit the existing mountpoint. Rather delete the existing mountpoint entirely, and then set it up again using the network browser. Some of the mount options are different between NFS and SMB, and it is just easier to set it up again from scratch.

Use network browser, click on the NAS. It sounds like you don't even need to enter a username and password at this point since I suspect the share is not password protected. The list of shares should be listed. There should be an NFS and SMB share with the the same name. Click on the SMB share, and again don't enter a username and password. All that needs to be done from there is to just save the mount with the default settings as provided.

If you run into trouble by not providing a username and password, then you can try the procedure again, but provide a valid username and password that has been configured for that share in your NAS. It is possible that your tech has configured a username and password on that share that matches your Windows username and password for you?

Thanks MrQuade - Ignorance is bliss. I'll delete my error.

[IanSav]

Hi Moparmartin,

If you need assistance to change the IP address of a NAS then it appears that you are not confident managing your own equipment. Network management is not an easy task yet it is very easy to get it wrong. Perhaps it would be a wise investment to hire your technical support person to come in and address all your network and setup issues.

Regards,
Ian.

[Moparmartin]

Answer to Ian. Thanks but it would appear that I have got the IP addresses set as static for the U4, the NAS and The Receiver. I would add that none of these addresses have ever changed since adding the U4 to my network. The NAS has sometimes lost it's address but rebooting always retrieves the same address and this fault appears to have stopped since the static setting.

Second issue (BTW I don't know how to get these greyed block quotes you guys use so I'' do it manually.)

MrQuade wrote....

"Use network browser, click on the NAS. It sounds like you don't even need to enter a username and password at this point since I suspect the share is not password protected. The list of shares should be listed. There should be an NFS and SMB share with the the same name. Click on the SMB share, and again don't enter a username and password. All that needs to be done from there is to just save the mount with the default settings as provided.

If you run into trouble by not providing a username and password, then you can try the procedure again, but provide a valid username and password that has been configured for that share in your NAS. It is possible that your tech has configured a username and password on that share that matches your Windows username and password for you?"

Answer:-
I use the network browser and it brings up everything on my network I click on the NAS and it shows the directories. You say I should have "an NFS and SMB share with the the same name." I don't. All I have is the directories expanded out under the NAS. There is no second NAS listing and no mention of the share type until I get into the detail. Opening the detail listing shows "Share type" as NFS. Selecting it and arrow right changes to CIFS and back to NFS. That tells me there are only 2 choices. At no point in this process have I seen anything saying SMB anywhere in the U4, only in my NAS. Am I doing something wrong or is the U4 missing something?

Delving this deep makes me now ask how do these "shares" work? Please correct me if I'm wrong but, I guessed that The mount is simply telling the U4 that it has access to the NAS and that the Shares are allocating which folders can be accessed. I'm desperately trying to get a mud map in my head of what is trying to be achieved then tackling the detail to make it work, but I think I'm getting a bit lost in detail because the pieces of the puzzle don't fit. I would do a lot better I could know the basic steps or overview required without the detail. Maybe then I could understand what each suggestion is actually tackling. So far I just follow detail and run into something missing or not working and learn nothing from the process. This makes it very difficult to contribute to the solution.

[MrQuade]

Answer:-
I use the network browser and it brings up everything on my network I click on the NAS and it shows the directories. You say I should have "an NFS and SMB share with the the same name." I don't. All I have is the directories expanded out under the NAS.

Here is a picture of some of the shares on my NAS for example.

Can you see that the top few shares have an NFS icon, and the bottom few shares have a CIFS icon? The CIFS ones are ones that use the SMB protocol, and are the ones we are suggesting you should try using. Your NAS should list some directories as NFS and some as CIFS as indicated by those icons.

Delving this deep makes me now ask how do these "shares" work? Please correct me if I'm wrong but, I guessed that The mount is simply telling the U4 that it has access to the NAS and that the Shares are allocating which folders can be accessed.

As far as terminology goes, here is an approximate "english description".

A "share" is something that your NAS is offering to the network. It is "sharing" the contents of one of its own directories and is acting as a file "server" since it is serving shares to the network.

A "mount" is something that a client device such as the Beyonwiz does. The client device has its own harddisk(s) and a filesystem inbuilt. If you want to access another server's shares, the client needs to "mount" that server's shared directory into the client's filesystem so that the client can pretend that the server's share'd directory is just another directory that the client has access to.

All you are doing is getting the Beyonwiz to connect to the NAS, and get access to its shared files.

[Paul_oz53]

I use the network browser and it brings up everything on my network I click on the NAS and it shows the directories. You say I should have "an NFS and SMB share with the the same name." I don't. All I have is the directories expanded out under the NAS. There is no second NAS listing and no mention of the share type until I get into the detail. Opening the detail listing shows "Share type" as NFS. Selecting it and arrow right changes to CIFS and back to NFS. That tells me there are only 2 choices. At no point in this process have I seen anything saying SMB anywhere in the U4, only in my NAS. Am I doing something wrong or is the U4 missing something?

OK Martin,

1. CIFS is an implementation of SMB (often referred to as Samba). Since it doesn't work as NFS, you can try CIFS instead. It won't break anything. As MrQuade has shown in his post, there should be an icon in the Network Browser with CIFS next to the folder name. The red X means the folder is not mounted. If it is Green, the U4 thinks the folder is mounted. But, regardless - I always remount even if a folder is supposedly mounted to remove all doubt. The settings I have told you to use work on all my machines. Don't overthink it. Just try it and see if it works for you too.

2. Create the new Mountpoint using the Network Browser, if you haven't already done so.
3. Use MountpointManager to check, and if necessary, edit that Mountpoint to look exactly like my earlier post with no username or password.
4. Save and activate the mount.
5. Go to Media/Location.
6. Open the folder name as per your NAS.
7. If it is fixed - great! Stop reading here.

8. If it is not fixed, go back to Mountpoint Manager.
9. Enter a username and password.
10. Save and activate the mount.
11. Go to Media/Location.
12. Open the folder name as per your NAS.
13. If it is fixed - great! If not, tell us and we'll try and figure out why not.

Delving this deep makes me now ask how do these "shares" work? Please correct me if I'm wrong but, I guessed that The mount is simply telling the U4 that it has access to the NAS and that the Shares are allocating which folders can be accessed. I'm desperately trying to get a mud map in my head of what is trying to be achieved then tackling the detail to make it work, but I think I'm getting a bit lost in detail because the pieces of the puzzle don't fit. I would do a lot better I could know the basic steps or overview required without the detail. Maybe then I could understand what each suggestion is actually tackling. So far I just follow detail and run into something missing or not working and learn nothing from the process. This makes it very difficult to contribute to the solution.

You're nearly on track. The Mount tells the U4 that it has access to the specific folder named in the mount.

That folder has certain restrictions or permissions attached to it, set by the NAS. If it is a public folder, this usually means at the very least, anyone can read the files in the folder. It usually also means that anyone can write to the folder or execute a program in the folder. The folder also has an associated access protocol which can be either NFS or CIFS (SMB).

The folder might require a user login before the user can access the files inside. If so, that is when you have to supply a username and password.

It is not easy to tell without checking the setup of your NAS, so we suggest you try without a username & password because that is the most likely choice. But, if that doesn't work, the next thing to try is with a username and password as set out above, as I suggest.

[Grumpy_Geoff]

If it doesn't work, then perhaps it's time for you to start supplying screenshots. e.g.
Mount Viewer screen, and Mounts editor screen from Mountpoints management.
The admin page from your Netgear ReadyNAS showing the share as it's defined on the NAS, and its access/permissions.

To take screenshots of what's showing on the U4, you can use either -

• The OpenWebif browser interface to the PVR, from on your PC.
  See this post - viewtopic.php?f=50&t=12411&p=165562&p165562#p165562
  You can use the browser virtual remote to drive the PVR screen, or use the real remote to get to the spot, and then 'Grab screenshot' or 'Refresh'.
  Here's a screenshot of a browser page navigated to a MountManager entry

  

  and the screenshot itself as grabbed, saved, uploaded to the forum

  

  Mount_editor.png (119.39 KiB) Viewed 4118 times

• The "ShootYourScreen" plugin.
  Some info on this just a few posts further on in the same topic as above.
  Your U4 is networked, so you can just download the plugin.
  Screenshots are saved on the U4's HDD. Either use File Commander to copy them, or access them from your PC using Windows File Explorer.

We'll get to the contents of the mount files on the U4 later, if we need to cross that bridge.

[sub3R]

(BTW I don't know how to get these greyed block quotes you guys use so I'' do it manually.)

Click on the grey ״ at the top right of the post you wish to quote from.

You can then highlight & delete the parts you don’t want to quote, but make sure you still retain the ‘[/quote]’ at the end.
Use ‘Preview’ to see how it looks. You can always change it after pre-viewing or even edit it (click on the pencil icon) after you submit it before someone reads it if you are quick enough.

To do multiple quotes from the same post, copy & past the same ‘[quote = name, ID, time, user ID ]’ further down in your post reply, copy & paste the part you wish to quote, then finish again with ‘[/quote]’.

I usually do all the above in a MS word document after copying & pasting to it, then copy & paste as a reply.

[Moparmartin]

Wow, this is all starting to make sense. Unfortunately, I'm just on the way to bed so this will be one of my tasks tomorrow. I'm a little short on time so I might not achieve it all tomorrow. I'm the editor for my car club magazine and I need to put this month's issue together by Monday and I've not started due to this and several other issues.

[Paul_oz53]

Hi Martin,

Page 53 of your NAS manual lists SMB/CIFS as a default enabled protocol on shared folders. This should mean it will work if you select CIFS and set the mount options to rw, utf8.

[Grumpy_Geoff]

Username blank Not on list
Password blank Not on list

The username and password options are on the second page of the Mounts editor screen.
You can CH-/+ to page down/up.

How do you access this share on the NAS from your PC? How do you view/play its content?
I don't think the PC would be using NFS to access this 'NAS-share'.
What happens on your PC, when in Windows File Explorer, you enter "\\192.168.0.10\{NAS-Share-Name}" in the explorer address bar?

[Moparmartin]

Ok guys, I haven't yet had time to setup the screen shots but I'll do it tomorrow. Suffice to say I have been through the mount manager and changed to CIFS and set the to rw,utf8 and no change. I've demounted and remounted and done it all again with the same result. When I go in to media and navigate to my NAS and press OK I get the message "Directory MEDIA/autofs/NAS does not exist. I will document every last step tomorrow and post the results but in the meantime, can I please repeat what I've said from the start, every attempt has resulted in this missing directory. From my knowledge of computers, it suggests to me that the process has failed at some point to creates the said directory. That must mean that something is not getting the correct or sufficient data to create this missing directory. I don't see any way of mounting as a CIFS because I see no choices in the process but after changing to CIFS plus the other setting and then demounting and remounting, it then defaults to CIFS but still doesn't find the directory. This thing is very stubborn and I'm now off for my Friday night "Beer O'Clock" I'll refocus tomorrow. Have a great evening guys.

[MrQuade]

Suffice to say I have been through the mount manager and changed to CIFS and set the to rw,utf8 and no change. I've demounted and remounted and done it all again with the same result.

I don't see any way of mounting as a CIFS because I see no choices in the process but after changing to CIFS plus the other setting and then demounting and remounting, it then defaults to CIFS but still doesn't find the directory.

If you can't see any CIFS shares when you are in the Network Browser, then simply changing the NFS mount to CIFS is never going to work. You need to be able to see the CIFS share in that tree/list like in the screenshot I posted.

Since you can't see any CIFS entries, then this is looking like an authentication issue. Basically, your NAS isn't allowing the Wiz to even provide a list of the CIFS shares until the Wiz has provided a proper username and password.

Now since your PC doesn't prompt you for a username and password when you connect to the NAS share, it says to me that the share credentials are either saved on your PC, or the share has been set so the username and password are the same as your Windows username and password.

When you click on the NAS in the Network browser, have you tried entering your Windows username and password?

Have you looked around in the NAS configuration screens for a list of users? Usually NAS units like yours will allow you to configure a set of users that can access the NAS. Each share is then configured with a list of users who are allowed to access that share.

[Grumpy_Geoff]

...When I go in to media and navigate to my NAS and press OK I get the message "Directory MEDIA/autofs/NAS does not exist.

...From my knowledge of computers, it suggests to me that the process has failed at some point to creates the said directory.

The Wiz doesn't create a directory named "NAS" on your ReadyNAS, the directory the 'Server share' name points to must already exist on your ReadyNAS and being shared out.

That must mean that something is not getting the correct or sufficient data to create this missing directory. I don't see any way of mounting as a CIFS because I see no choices in the process but after changing to CIFS plus the other setting and then demounting and remounting, it then defaults to CIFS but still doesn't find the directory.

That's why I asked my questions here about how you currently access that particular share.

[Paul_oz53]

...
From my knowledge of computers, it suggests to me that the process has failed at some point to creates the said directory. That must mean that something is not getting the correct or sufficient data to create this missing directory. I don't see any way of mounting as a CIFS because I see no choices in the process but after changing to CIFS plus the other setting and then demounting and remounting, it then defaults to CIFS but still doesn't find the directory. This thing is very stubborn ...

It certainly is stubborn. However, the U4 mount process does not create a directory: it attempts to access a directory which exists on your NAS. (Snap GG!)

It is time to check the setup of specific user share access on your NAS. As MrQuade points out, the NAS is not even displaying the CIFS shares. Either it is looking for the credentials first or the tech disabled CIFS when he set up the NAS.

On page 57 of your NAS manual is a screenshot of the shares page of your NAS. Take a picture of that screen on your NAS and upload it here. It should tell us what we need to know to figure out if it is a permissions issue. Make sure the folder you are trying to access is visible in the photo.

We are looking for SMB or NFS being listed and "anonymous" being present or a specific username.

Further, one possible cause of your access problem is on page 67 of your NAS manual:

8. Click the Hosts tab on the left side of the pop-up window.

Note: If the host access list is empty, any host is allowed to access the shared folder. If you add at least one host to the list, access to the shared folder is restricted to hosts on the list only.

You may need to follow the instructions on this page to add the IP address of the U4 as a host under the SMB and/or NFS tabs if your PC has been setup as a host. If it is, it would appear that no other machine is allowed to access the NAS. This could explain why the U4 is having problems.

Best you check first and ask before you change this though. You may accidentally cut off the PC access if you make a mistake here.

[Moparmartin]

I'm just checking in as I go to bed, not totally sober so not thinking clearly but this all sounds interesting. A couple of things to tell you, firstly my tech guy is actually a friend who builds and repairs computers. he's due to come over soon for a cabling job. I know that my NAS has it's own username and password which I have and it's not the same as my windows credentials. He uses mine so we only have one entry point. MY NAS has powered off for the night so can't check but if I try to access it via the wrong path I'm blocked and I keep forgetting until I poke around and find it again. This stuff doesn't generally rate high on my priority list and I don't often need to access the NAS and then it's usually he admin page. I will be busy tomorrow morning as we have an Enphase solar battery being installed but will attend to all of this later. My list of things to check is rapidly growing and I will try to address them all.

[MrQuade]

Just remember (and sorry for the repetition), that the username and password that you use to access the files stored on the NAS shares is often (and SHOULD be) different to the administration password that you use to get into the NAS settings.

[Grumpy_Geoff]

...I know that my NAS has it's own username and password which I have and it's not the same as my windows credentials. He uses mine so we only have one entry point.

When we refer to your ReadyNAS user name and password, we're not referring to any user name & password that you use to administer the ReadyNAS system (the 'admin' login) - we're referring to a user name & password that may have been set for the share/directory on your ReadyNAS that you wish to allow the U4 to access.

Something like this - https://kb.netgear.com/26453/ReadyNAS-O ... ed-Folders

[Moparmartin]

Problem Solved! I always thought it would be something simple, I just didn't realize it was going to be me! Now that I've begun to get a mud map in my head of what should happen and I've gone back and re read ALL your posts. A lot of the suggestions initially made little or no sense when things didn't go the way they should. When I said that the folders that expanded under the NAS only had NFS it's because I looked at the folders and that was all the folders on the NAS apart from the Data backup folders. I assumed (FOOL) that that was the complete listing. So I edited the NFS Movie folder share to change it to CIFS which didn't work. Today I spent more time scrutinizing the screens and realized there was a slider bar on the right side that I hadn't noticed! Arrowed down, found the CIFS movie folder, shared that and it went green. Back to Media and it works.
Such a very basic error through concentrating on the difficult concepts and missing the stuff you guys would be doing automatically. I thank you all for you patience, it must have been driving you mad too.
On the subject of assumptions, I read about screenshots and easily got to that screen but I can't see how to take the shot nor do I have any clue as to where it should be on the HDD but it's just not there so obviously I didn't take the shot. I even checked the clipboard just in case. So then I downloaded the plugin "Shoot my screen" and had exactly the same issue. No obvious controls and no help. Net result is that I can't use either facility. I'm tipping it's sitting right under my nose but I can't see it. I obviously need a different mind set so I don't continue annoying the hell out of you.
Please know that I am very very grateful for all your assistance. Now back to that 4K sound loss, I better go back to that post.

[prl]

On the subject of assumptions, I read about screenshots and easily got to that screen but I can't see how to take the shot nor do I have any clue as to where it should be on the HDD but it's just not there so obviously I didn't take the shot. I even checked the clipboard just in case. So then I downloaded the plugin "Shoot my screen" and had exactly the same issue. No obvious controls and no help.

You don't do screen shots directly on the PVR. The Beyonwiz T & U models have a Web interface called Open Webif. You access it just by typing the network name (a U4's name defaults to beyonwizu4) into the address bar on the browser of your computer of choice. If that doesn't work, use the PVR's IP address instead.

When the Open Webif page opens, go to the panel on the left edge of the screen, and click Grab Screenshot. When the screenshot appears, right-click on it and Save Image As... Then you can rename the screenshot to something sensible and save it anywhere you want on your computer.

If you want higher resolution tick the box under the screenshot marked High Resolution. The screenshot will reload at a higher resolution, and then always load at the higher resolution until you un-tick the box.

Net result is that I can't use either facility. I'm tipping it's sitting right under my nose but I can't see it.

You can. You just need to look in the right place.

[Moparmartin]

Thank you. I just turned the U4 off as I'm on the way to bed. I did use the the web interface. It would appear that I must have done something wrong. I'll try again tomorrow. I dont't need to master this issue so I won't bother anyone again on this matter. Thanks

[Paul_oz53]

Thank you. I just turned the U4 off as I'm on the way to bed. I did use the the web interface. It would appear that I must have done something wrong. I'll try again tomorrow. I dont't need to master this issue so I won't bother anyone again on this matter. Thanks

Hi Martin,

I'm sure we're all relieved that you have solved the U4 networking problem.

Not sure what you mean by ...I must have done something wrong... If you mean using OpenWebif, just take your time and experiment. It is a very powerful and convenient way to operate the U4 from a computer, tablet or phone.

By all means, do some research first but don't be afraid to ask if there are other questions on your mind. The U4 is very powerful and some interactions can be puzzling to new users. Just ask as calmly and as simply as you can and we're happy to help.

[Moparmartin]

Thank you Paul & everyone,
Thank you for your help and concern. It is VERY much appreciated. I do like to work things out myself but I'm very good at missing the simple things while bogging down in complexity. I think I was a bit overwhelmed with all the responses and I struggled to try to address them all in a timely manner. I'll go and play with the rest of it until I get stumped again. I'm also finding the way the menus work is not very consistent. Sometimes you use the OK and sometimes it's a colored button. Stepping back is the same using different buttons at different levels. I find this all very distracting during this familiarization stage. No doubt I'll get there in time. I've watched quite a few Youtube videos and you're right, the U4 is very powerful and has some amazing capabilities. Now I just want to chase this sound loss with the up scale, so back to the other post.

[prl]

I'm also finding the way the menus work is not very consistent. Sometimes you use the OK and sometimes it's a colored button. Stepping back is the same using different buttons at different levels.

IanSav is currently working on revisions to the Setup screen code and when/if that is completed and accepted into the code it will probably address some of those inconsistencies.

[IanSav]

Hi,

Work is progressing quite well though I don't know if or when Beyonwiz will get the code.

I have now changed emphasis from the Beyonwiz image to the OpenViX and OpenPLi images. It has become unworkable for me continue wasting large amounts of time and effort trying to get code accepted into the Beyonwiz image (see here for an example). I am no longer maintaining Beyonwiz compatibility / functionality as a priority. This is likely to cause some level of problem in the future as the Beyonwiz code differs from both OpenViX and OpenPLi.

I am unable to get any public code testing done for the Beyonwiz image. Without access to Beyonwiz testers I won't proceed to formal production code submission.

I regret being forced into this position but the circumstances are completely out of my control.

Regards,
Ian.

[IanSav]

Hi Prl,

Please move the appropriate posts to a thread in the developers area so I can discuss my reservations with you.

Regards,
Ian.

[prl]

Done. I have copied your post that I replied to into the first post that was moved for the sake of context, and left the original here.

[IanSav]

Hi Prl,

Thank you.

Regards,
Ian.

[Star6key]

I must be a glutton for punishment...

I've decided to try and connect my PC to the T4, but I seem to be having the same issue as Moparmartin -

No problems connecting to the PC, as it displayed the shared directory in the Network browser.

I don't understand why the username/password have those entries as I delete them then save, but when I view the entry, those fields always come back (is this the issue?).

That's interesting... this last image was a shot of the error message on the T4 ("Directory MEDIA/autofs/MyTVShows does not exist"), but it seems webif doesn't see that screen.


The TV folder has no username/password, and there are 251 sub folders with no files in the top folder (if that makes a difference).

Thoughts?

[MrQuade]

Thoughts?

Using Windows 10?
You *must* provide a username and password. Modern Windows with default settings requires you to provide username and passwords to even list shares and make an initial connection. That is completely regardless of what the actual share permissions are set to.

With Windows 10, you also need to provide some extra mount options in the Wiz's mount definition. Windows will refuse SMB version 1 connections, so you must specify a version.

Mount options should read "rw,utf8,vers=2.1" (you can use 3.0 or 2.0 for a T4, but it would be safer to use 2.1 as that is the only one that will work for a T3 and should be more universal)

[Star6key]

Thoughts?

Using Windows 10?
You *must* provide a username and password. Modern Windows with default settings requires you to provide username and passwords to even list shares and make an initial connection. That is completely regardless of what the actual share permissions are set to.

With Windows 10, you also need to provide some extra mount options in the Wiz's mount definition. Windows will refuse SMB version 1 connections, so you must specify a version.

Mount options should read "rw,utf,vers=2.1" (you can use 3.0 or 2.0 for a T4, but it would be safer to use 2.1 as that is the only one that will work for a T3 and should be more universal)

Yes Win10.

"rw,utf,vers=2.1"
You almost got it... but I take it you meant "utf8" (which worked ), not "utf".

Thanks MrQuade.

[MrQuade]

You almost got it... but I take it you meant "utf8" (which worked ), not "utf".

Yes, sorry. I blame the late night on the typo!

Fixed now.

[Star6key]

I don't know a lot about networking, but something doesn't seem right.

I can access my PC and play files in the shared folder (although the T4 won't show the video for HEVC files... might have to think about getting the U4 ). However, when I stop playing the file on the T4, the resource monitor in Windows shows that it is still sending data to the T4, as if the file is still playing. If I play an FTA file, the data is still being sent to the T4 ip address (about 8 MB/s). When I tried to reboot the T4, the data slowly started decreasing until it stopped, however the T4 was still displaying the 'Rebooting' screen. In fact it took about 2 more minutes for it to finally reboot.

This can't be normal, can it?

[MrQuade]

Try using the Process Monitor tool from Sysinternals (now owned by Microsoft).

That can tell you what files are being opened and access by your PC.

You can also try TCPView, though that might only tell you what protocol is being used, and is very similar to the built-in advances process monitoring tool that is baked into Windows 10 task manager now.

Is your T4's DLNA server configured to point at the share? Perhaps it is trying to index the files on the share?

[Star6key]

...
Is your T4's DLNA server configured to point at the share? Perhaps it is trying to index the files on the share?

Hammer, meet nail.

8192_0_1_0_0_0_0_0_0_0_20180927135710.jpg (104.41 KiB) Viewed 3346 times

Thanks again MrQuade.