A quick guide to Beyonwiz T series AutoTimers

craigh · Post by **craigh** » Tue Oct 20, 2015 17:51

simoncasey wrote:In that case, the first term must be in the description. It would not be an or.

I gave it a try, worked with the first match entry in the description but any others I included did not generate a timer.

All terms would work in the match field by themselves though.

simoncasey · Post by **simoncasey** » Tue Oct 20, 2015 17:53

craigh wrote:
simoncasey wrote:In that case, the first term must be in the description. It would not be an or.
I gave it a try, worked with the first match entry in the description but any others I included did not generate a timer.

All terms would work in the match field by themselves though.

yes, I think it needs 3 separate autotimers matching on the description

simoncasey · Post by **simoncasey** » Tue Oct 20, 2015 17:57

prl wrote: Modify existing timers controls whether and how timers are updated if their event's time changes in the EPG. "None" disables this feature. "All non-repeating timers" allows the timer to be modified even if its event id is different from the event id in the EPG, and "Only AutoTimers with the same EIT" allows the timer to be changed if the EPG event id is the same as the timer event id. If you want to modify timers using "Guess existing timer on begin/end" (below), you need to set this to "All non-repeating timers". If "Guess existing" is disabled, "All non-repeating timers" and "Only AutoTimers with the same EIT" should have the same effect.

If you had All non-repeating timers set for this option, would it start to modify any IceTV timers that were in place, or does something else keep them separate.

Trial_Master · Post by **Trial_Master** » Tue Oct 20, 2015 20:09

craigh wrote:I gave it a try, worked with the first match entry in the description but any others I included did not generate a timer.

All terms would work in the match field by themselves though.

Ok so if I’ve got that all read correctly I create separate autotimers for each keyword in the Match Title field and select Description Match?

craigh · Post by **craigh** » Tue Oct 20, 2015 20:23

Trial_Master wrote:
craigh wrote:I gave it a try, worked with the first match entry in the description but any others I included did not generate a timer.

All terms would work in the match field by themselves though.
Ok so if I’ve got that all read correctly I create separate autotimers for each keyword in the Match Title field and select Description Match?

Worth a try.

All that happens is it may or may not create the timers.

test it with 3 keywords for descriptions you can see in the peg as a test.

Trial_Master · Post by **Trial_Master** » Tue Oct 20, 2015 20:35

M'mmm didn't create a timer, I will keep fiddling and see what works.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

EDIT: Nope they are there now? Must take a minute to appear? Thanks for your help everyone.

grampus · Post by **grampus** » Tue Oct 20, 2015 21:34

Just tried to setup an autotimer for X factor. This should return timers for next Monday and Tuesday.
I create it using everyday, any time.
It creates the Monday one. But the timer forntuesday doesn't show up in my timer list.
If use the option to preview the autotimer. It shows both Monday and Tuesday as being selected.

I am in a small state of confusion. How can it show up in the preview but not in the timer list?
It's kind of given me a mental block, and I need some help to start looking, where?
Other auto timers appear to be working.

Grumpy_Geoff · Post by **Grumpy_Geoff** » Tue Oct 20, 2015 21:54

grampus wrote:Just tried to setup an autotimer for X factor. This should return timers for next Monday and Tuesday.
I create it using everyday, any time.
It creates the Monday one. But the timer forntuesday doesn't show up in my timer list.
If use the option to preview the autotimer. It shows both Monday and Tuesday as being selected.
...

Go to OpenWebif
Enter "x factor" in the 'Epg Search' field (Bottom LH corner) and then hit 'search'
See that the programs all have the same description -
"Dannii Minogue is joined by Guy Sebastian and international music superstars Chris Isaak and James Blunt for an all-new season of The X Factor. PG CC"?
Did you set 'Check for uniqueness' field?

I don't believe the AutoTimer 'preview' takes that check into account at preview time - only timer generation time.

simoncasey · Post by **simoncasey** » Tue Oct 20, 2015 21:56

Is next Tuesday in the epg? It's only Tuesday today. Check that the preview isn't picking up today's episode.

grampus · Post by **grampus** » Wed Oct 21, 2015 05:26

Seems to have been a "phantom" timer set for X factor for Tuesday.
I removed my autotimer. And clicked on remove all entries.
Then checked timers. No entry for X factor at all in my timers.
Then did epg search for X factor, Monday's and tues X factor shows were noted. But, the Tuesday had the timer icon against one of its entries.
Although not seen in the timer list.
Used the Tuesday entry to create autotimer, anytime, any day. Previously I was using the Monday.
Then it selected both Monday and Tuesday. Both showed up in the timer list. My problem solved, but the mystery remains I think.

One thing that I noticed early on during the debacle was that I had my time source set for transponder, I changed that to NTP.
Not sure why I went to that setting. But I think I recall just recently there was a mention of a channel (unknown) that may have provided an incorrect time.

Trial_Master · Post by **Trial_Master** » Wed Oct 21, 2015 07:16

prl wrote:
Trial_Master wrote:...
I have a few keywords I used to record with IceTV. I would like to set up similar with Autotimers. I have set up filters for ShortDescription and Description with the include keywords but does it matter what I use for Match Title and it's associated options?
Filters are only applied to the events that match in Match title, so it matters a great deal.

Why not use "description match" for the "Search type" in "Match title"? Use what you think is the most selective keyword here, and the remaining keywords (if any) in the filters. "Description match" matches if the match string is in either the short description or the extended description. The match respects the cases sensitivity setting for "Match title".

Trial_Master wrote:The problem I think I may face with Autotimers is with programmes not currently in the guide. You have to hope your Match Title is spot so you don't miss a show when it returns. IceTV is certainly the safer option in that regard. Having fun setting my new T4 up but not sure how long I'll run with Autotimers.
Yes, the inconsistency of naming in the FTA EPG is one of its several failings.

Trial_Master wrote:EDIT: I just tried to connect to T4 via OpenWebif and page timed out. I had activated WoL so I sent a packet to wake it and could then connect. I thought I read you could connect to OpenWebif when machine is in standby? I haven't changed the power settings from their default and am running latest production firmware.
There's a "power switch" in Open WebIf at the top right under the "Open Source Web Interface for Linux set-top box" and the box type heading. I've always been able to switch T series boxes in and out of standby (not shutdown/deep standby) using that switch. But I don't have WoL enabled. Open Webif responds to browser requests when the box is in standby.

I wouldn't have expected the Open Webif page to be smart enough to know when it needed to send a WoL packet.

BTW, I recall peteru having measured power consumption in shutdown with WoL enabled as not being all that much less than power consumption in standby, so "shutdown with WoL" may be a false economy.

I currently only have the network and power cables plugged into unit in my office so I could feed autotimers in via webpage. I will move it to the lounge room on Saturday.

Right so this morning the T4 appeared to be in deep standby again (display off). This is the second morning when it has done this overnight. I haven’t been unable to untick WoL box as it’s not visible on Open Web page but that’s all I changed, no other power settings.

Would the settings in EPG Refresh cause a deep standby? I recall the settings I used were for it to start at 02:15 and end at 06:30. It seems odd that WoL tick box would force a deep standby overnight, the box remains in normal standby all day and still ok when I go to bed.

Any thoughts guys?

simoncasey · Post by **simoncasey** » Wed Oct 21, 2015 07:19

It might be worth moving this into another topic as it is straying from autotimers. There is a setting in epgrefresh to put the Tx into standby when finished and I believe that means deep standby.
Otherwise you may have a timer that puts into deep standby when finished or a sleep timer.

Trial_Master · Post by **Trial_Master** » Wed Oct 21, 2015 07:39

simoncasey wrote:It might be worth moving this into another topic as it is straying from autotimers. There is a setting in epgrefresh to put the Tx into standby when finished and I believe that means deep standby.
Otherwise you may have a timer that puts into deep standby when finished or a sleep timer.

Thanks Simon I'll check timer and sleep timer settings. I've disabled WoL now.

raymondjpg · Post by **raymondjpg** » Wed Oct 21, 2015 09:06

simoncasey wrote:You can't use include filters for Danish, Denmark and Copenhagen as include filters are AND so would require all three terms.

Does that apply to exclude filters as well? I take it from your explicit statement of "include filters" that it does not.

simoncasey · Post by **simoncasey** » Wed Oct 21, 2015 09:27

If you specify multiple include filters then the match has to include all of them. If you specify multiple exclude filters then the match has to exclude all of them.

However, you can use regular expressions to make more complex filters but the logic starts to get complicated.

I found it easier to debug if I had multiple auto timers for the OR case.

But note, I was really trying to assist on the match text on description question which doesn't use regular expressions

raymondjpg · Post by **raymondjpg** » Wed Oct 21, 2015 09:40

simoncasey wrote:If you specify multiple include filters then the match has to include all of them. If you specify multiple exclude filters then the match has to exclude all of them.

However, you can use regular expressions to make more complex filters but the logic starts to get complicated.

I found it easier to debug if I had multiple auto timers for the OR case.

But note, I was really trying to assist on the match text on description question which doesn't use regular expressions

I think I see that you were more focused on "match text in description".

To get back to filters, I have two exclude filters set up in the autotimer default settings, one for "(?i)encore" and one for "(?i)rpt", both in short description. From what you say both of these expressions need to be found in the short description for the EPG entry to be ignored. However, the filter settings appear to have have worked for a show which had just the expression "encore" in the short description, and not "rpt". The show repeat is on the same channel as the original showing, and I do not require the description to be unique in the default settings.

simoncasey · Post by **simoncasey** » Wed Oct 21, 2015 09:48

For exclude, I meant the opposite of what you said twice.

Ie for a show to still be recorded (matched) all of the exclude statements can must be missing. So what you have is correct. If you reverse all parts of that logic: for a show to be ignored, any of the the excluded statements must exist.

raymondjpg · Post by **raymondjpg** » Wed Oct 21, 2015 10:05

simoncasey wrote:...for a show to still be recorded (matched) all of the exclude statements can must be missing. So what you have is correct. If you reverse all parts of that logic: for a show to be ignored, any of the the excluded statements must exist.

Thanks for that clarification. I take it from that logic that for a show to still be recorded (matched) all of the include statements can must be present. If so, that accords with what I understood you to be saying before. And if all that is right then it is perhaps fortunate that (so far) I haven't seen the need to set any include filters on autotimers.

simoncasey · Post by **simoncasey** » Wed Oct 21, 2015 10:15

Yes, exclude filters are much more useful than include filters. Maybe an example for includes would be to only record episodes of Escape to the Country that are about Cornwall or episodes of Doctor Who starring Matt Smith.

prl · Post by **prl** » Wed Oct 21, 2015 10:54

Grumpy_Geoff wrote:...
I don't believe the AutoTimer 'preview' takes that check into account at preview time - only timer generation time.

That is correct.

And on your answer to grampus's question, you're also right, 'Check for uniqueness' is not checked in Preview. The guide even says so, and also explains that 'Check for uniqueness' isn't useful if episodes always have the same description.

Gully · Post by **Gully** » Wed Oct 21, 2015 16:20

I haven't tried Preview yet as I forgot about that but I am having a problem with an Autotimer I created for Media Watch. It isn't generating timers!

I have checked all the settings, even deleted and recreated it as originally it was created from an IceTV timer.

Using defaults like title begins with, case insensitve, any time, any day any service.

Any thoughts/ideas?

prl · Post by **prl** » Wed Oct 21, 2015 16:46

Gully wrote:I haven't tried Preview yet as I forgot about that but I am having a problem with an Autotimer I created for Media Watch. It isn't generating timers!

I have checked all the settings, even deleted and recreated it as originally it was created from an IceTV timer.

Using defaults like title begins with, case insensitve, any time, any day any service.

Any thoughts/ideas?

Media Watch is one of those troublesome programs that has the same description for every episode. If you have a recording of it and have set "Require description to be unique" to "Any service/recording", as suggested in my guide, the recording will be filtered out by the presence of the recording..

Try using Preview, it skips the uniqueness test so if there's a difference in what you see there for Media Watch and what you actually get, it may be the uniqueness test.

You may want to use a time-of-day based filter to get only the Monday showing of MW, and not get the repeat in the small hours of Thursday morning, and turn off the uniqueness test.

Gully · Post by **Gully** » Wed Oct 21, 2015 21:54

Thanks Peter that looks like the problem.

I haven't worried too much about restricting time or day for now to allow a safety net as I am happy to just disable the extra timers.

Some shows do get moved around, and while the ABC is better than most, restricting would miss some like The Chaser which moved from Wednesday to Thursday for some reason.

prl · Post by **prl** » Wed Oct 21, 2015 22:08

Gully wrote:Thanks Peter that looks like the problem.

I haven't worried too much about restricting time or day for now to allow a safety net as I am happy to just disable the extra timers.

Some shows do get moved around, and while the ABC is better than most, restricting would miss some like The Chaser which moved from Wednesday to Thursday for some reason.

No problem.

On the couple of AutoTimers I had that were like this, I was able to put an exclusion on something like 01:00-04:00. That won't always work, though.

Gully · Post by **Gully** » Wed Oct 21, 2015 22:26

prl wrote:On the couple of AutoTimers I had that were like this, I was able to put an exclusion on something like 01:00-04:00. That won't always work, though.

Could be worth considering.

Down the track I might look at some of those options and see where other filters might help reduce "repeats".

blonk · Post by **blonk** » Thu Oct 22, 2015 18:18

What's the best option to prevent the pop-up asking to go to standby, when an autotimer ends whilst I'm watching something? All of mine are currently set to "go to standby" Would auto, or Standard be the best option?

Blonk

craigh · Post by **craigh** » Thu Oct 22, 2015 18:34

I will add this from my other thread on trash folder issues.

The autotimer option for unique description is great to remove potential of duplicate timers.

However if your quick to watch a recording and delete it you may get a duplicate as it would appear the auto timer code looks at epg and recordings to do the description comparison. NOT in the Trash folder.

Would adding .Trash as well make a good enhancement ?

simoncasey · Post by **simoncasey** » Thu Oct 22, 2015 18:46

craigh wrote:I will add this from my other thread on trash folder issues.

The autotimer option for unique description is great to remove potential of duplicate timers.

However if your quick to watch a recording and delete it you may get a duplicate as it would appear the auto timer code looks at epg and recordings to do the description comparison. NOT in the Trash folder.

Would adding .Trash as well make a good enhancement ?

As per my post in the other topic, if you keep the old timer and not clear it out then that will prevent the duplicate depending on how long you keep old timers for.

craigh · Post by **craigh** » Thu Oct 22, 2015 18:52

simoncasey wrote:
craigh wrote:I will add this from my other thread on trash folder issues.

The autotimer option for unique description is great to remove potential of duplicate timers.

However if your quick to watch a recording and delete it you may get a duplicate as it would appear the auto timer code looks at epg and recordings to do the description comparison. NOT in the Trash folder.

Would adding .Trash as well make a good enhancement ?
As per my post in the other topic, if you keep the old timer and not clear it out then that will prevent the duplicate depending on how long you keep old timers for.

yes i saw your comment previously.

Just checked and I have no old timers, even though i had it set to 7 days.

Changed it to 10 days and will look if it changes behaviour.

is the setting re keep timers the same for normal timers and those created by autotimer ?

jazza · Post by **jazza** » Thu Oct 22, 2015 19:23

prl wrote:
Gully wrote:Thanks Peter that looks like the problem.

I haven't worried too much about restricting time or day for now to allow a safety net as I am happy to just disable the extra timers.

Some shows do get moved around, and while the ABC is better than most, restricting would miss some like The Chaser which moved from Wednesday to Thursday for some reason.
No problem.

On the couple of AutoTimers I had that were like this, I was able to put an exclusion on something like 01:00-04:00. That won't always work, though.

Or you can set a timer recording count with a reset counter day of week set. This is useful if you know a show repeats a few times a week and you tell it it only record 1 show per week but reset counter on Sunday for example.

craigh · Post by **craigh** » Thu Oct 22, 2015 19:26

craigh wrote:
simoncasey wrote:
craigh wrote:I will add this from my other thread on trash folder issues.

The autotimer option for unique description is great to remove potential of duplicate timers.

However if your quick to watch a recording and delete it you may get a duplicate as it would appear the auto timer code looks at epg and recordings to do the description comparison. NOT in the Trash folder.

Would adding .Trash as well make a good enhancement ?
As per my post in the other topic, if you keep the old timer and not clear it out then that will prevent the duplicate depending on how long you keep old timers for.
yes i saw your comment previously.

Just checked and I have no old timers, even though i had it set to 7 days.

Changed it to 10 days and will look if it changes behaviour.

is the setting re keep timers the same for normal timers and those created by autotimer ?

So even with "Remove Completed timers after (days)" = 10 the timers are disappearing as soon as a timer finishes !!!! any ideas

Update - Think I found it....The Kodi boxes are cleaning up timers. Will disable that and check again

Gully · Post by **Gully** » Thu Oct 22, 2015 21:35

Discovered one benefit from using Autotimers in place of IceTV.

I've always watched Gruen on a Wednesday night but my autotimer found Gruen XL on Thursday night, which IceTV lists as a repeat but is in fact an extended version running an extra 15 minutes.

Fairly common on UK TV but the first time I have seen it as a regular thing here.

IanSav · Post by **IanSav** » Thu Oct 22, 2015 22:21

Hi Gully,

GruenXL

Regards,
Ian.

kenmax · Post by **kenmax** » Sun Oct 25, 2015 19:37

Not sure this is right place but please move if not.
Testing filters on AutoTimers and program desc is:

Resurrection
The second return of a loved one arrives at the home of the Richards family and the Langstons are forced to confront secrets from their past when Bellamy pushes to have Jacob's tomb exhumed. M CC Rpt

I have set AutoTimer as per image to exclude 'Rpt' and the Wiz stills creates a timer event, what am I doing wrong?

Grumpy_Geoff · Post by **Grumpy_Geoff** » Sun Oct 25, 2015 21:00

kenmax wrote:...
I have set AutoTimer as per image to exclude 'Rpt' and the Wiz stills creates a timer event, what am I doing wrong?

I just tried it, and I didn't get a timer generated. Do you have a space at the end of "Rpt"?
Additionally, you only need to exclude on 'Shortdescription' in this case.

simoncasey · Post by **simoncasey** » Sun Oct 25, 2015 21:05

One thing worth checking that has caught me out before is that autotimers won't delete a timer if it no longer matches. Ie if the timer was created previously and you then change the filters, it won't get removed. Try deleting the problem timer and see if it gets recreated.

Gully · Post by **Gully** » Sun Oct 25, 2015 21:48

Also Exact match would not get all of those anyway. AS per the guide you would be better using begins with and case insensitive.

kenmax · Post by **kenmax** » Sun Oct 25, 2015 22:47

I just tried it, and I didn't get a timer generated. Do you have a space at the end of "Rpt"?
Additionally, you only need to exclude on 'Shortdescription' in this case.

No space at end of Rpt, I realize I should only need it the one type but I was covering all bases to get it to work!

One thing worth checking that has caught me out before is that autotimers won't delete a timer if it no longer matches. Ie if the timer was created previously and you then change the filters, it won't get removed..

I was wondering about whether if the EPG changes it checks to see if existing times are checked for validity, I guess that answers that.

Try deleting the problem timer and see if it gets recreated.

I have deleted it a few times and it still keeps creating a new one.

Also Exact match would not get all of those anyway. AS per the guide you would be better using begins with and case insensitive.

I don't understand, I have 'Exact Match' set and 'case sensitive' in this instance is not affecting what I find, it is finding the right program I just can't stop it from recording with the exclude filter.

prl · Post by **prl** » Mon Oct 26, 2015 10:20

I was going to give this a try, but in Canberra where I am, Prime 7 EPG is showing How To Get Away With Murder from Mon 23:30-Tue 00:30.

Grumpy_Geoff · Post by **Grumpy_Geoff** » Mon Oct 26, 2015 11:03

prl wrote:I was going to give this a try, but in Canberra where I am, Prime 7 EPG is showing How To Get Away With Murder from Mon 23:30-Tue 00:30.

In Perth, it's on after How To Get Away With Murder
7 Digital:
23:35 - How To Get Away With Murder
00:30 - Resurrection - Double Episode
01:28 - Resurrection

Grumpy_Geoff · Post by **Grumpy_Geoff** » Mon Oct 26, 2015 11:06

kenmax wrote:No space at end of Rpt, I realize I should only need it the one type but I was covering all bases to get it to work!

Here's my AutoTimer settings to test this. If I mangle the exclude filter, then the timer would generate. If I correct the filter, no timer would generate (once I wait for spinner to finish / preview popup to populate)

Cheers
Geoff

simoncasey · Post by **simoncasey** » Mon Oct 26, 2015 11:11

Also, have you checked the autotimer on the UI itself. There may be an issue where OpenWebIF isn't showing one of the settings properly.

prl · Post by **prl** » Mon Oct 26, 2015 11:52

Grumpy_Geoff wrote:
prl wrote:I was going to give this a try, but in Canberra where I am, Prime 7 EPG is showing How To Get Away With Murder from Mon 23:30-Tue 00:30.
In Perth, it's on after How To Get Away With Murder
7 Digital:
23:35 - How To Get Away With Murder
00:30 - Resurrection - Double Episode
01:28 - Resurrection

Prime7 Canberra:
23:30 - How To Get Away With Murder
00:30 - Home Shopping
01:00 - Home Shopping
01:30 - Home Shopping
02:00 - Home Shopping
... etc

Aren't we the lucky ones

Grumpy_Geoff · Post by **Grumpy_Geoff** » Mon Oct 26, 2015 11:57

prl wrote:...
00:30 - Home Shopping
01:00 - Home Shopping
01:30 - Home Shopping
02:00 - Home Shopping
... etc

Aren't we the lucky ones

Directed at the nearby residents of "Struggletown"?

celicasx · Post by **celicasx** » Mon Oct 26, 2015 23:16

To reduce repeats, as reported elsewhere in the forum, I've excluded in both description and short description the following;
(?i)rpt
\[RPT\]

Regards
Rob

prl · Post by **prl** » Tue Oct 27, 2015 09:07

There's no need to have both (?i)rpt and \[RPT\]. The first will match everything that the second matches.

Gully · Post by **Gully** » Mon Feb 08, 2016 22:08

I've been wondering if I am missing an option to improve my autotimers to use HD broadcasts where available?

I don't usually specify service/channel so timers get created on the SD service, even when there is a HD broadcast at the same time.

So does anyone know how it is decided which service to use?

Would putting the HD services earlier in the bouquet change which one gets chosen?

I looked at whether adding alternatives to services would help but couldn't see any indication that it would.

And I should say I don't want to specify a service for an autotimer in case there are weeks where it isn't simulcast in SD and HD.

dRdoS7 · Post by **dRdoS7** » Tue Feb 09, 2016 12:58

Hi,

Gully wrote:So does anyone know how it is decided which service to use?

No, but I only have the HD services (9 & SBS, where they are sim. of SD) in my Favorites.

The only show I can think of that's sim. on all of Ten Net. is Family Feud. Is that why you ask?

If there's a show for instance, on 7 & 7Mate, AT would record both, unless only 7 is specified.

Gully wrote:And I should say I don't want to specify a service for an autotimer in case there are weeks where it isn't simulcast in SD and HD.

Does that happen? I thought they were always the same. Only time I have seen SBS use SBS2 sim. on SBSHD instead of SBS, was every weekend several years ago. That was annoying.

dRdoS7

Grumpy_Geoff · Post by **Grumpy_Geoff** » Tue Feb 09, 2016 13:01

Gully wrote:I've been wondering if I am missing an option to improve my autotimers to use HD broadcasts where available?

I don't usually specify service/channel so timers get created on the SD service, even when there is a HD broadcast at the same time.

So does anyone know how it is decided which service to use?

I don't know, but I'm guessing that in your EPG feed, the program of interest is listed on the SD service first and detected by the AutoTimer plugin prior to the AutoTimer then reaching the same program entry on the HD service.

Gully wrote:Would putting the HD services earlier in the bouquet change which one gets chosen?

Not from my testing. I don't believe bouquet order will influence timer generation (but bouquet contents will of course).

Gully wrote:And I should say I don't want to specify a service for an autotimer in case there are weeks where it isn't simulcast in SD and HD.

I thought that 9HD was always a HD simulcast of Nine since Nov-2015, with no programming differences, same with SBS and SBS HD?
I don't think you can influence the AutoTimer service selection without restricting it to either a bouquet which has the SD channels replaced with their simulcasted HD channel equivalents, or a specific service.
The other option I can think of is to specify both HD and SD services against the AutoTimer and put up with two recordings. If what you believe is true and there are programming differences, then you'll get the program recorded on whatever service happened to broadcast it.

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