OverlayHD Skin...

[IanSav]

Hi MrQuade,

But as a UI design I find the layout of that screen confusing. You have information showing in the right hand pane that is relevant to both the currently highlighted service, and the currently zapped service, which will often not be the same thing.
As a non OverlayHD user, I realise my opinion doesn't hold much weight here, but I think it would be better to sacrifice a little bit of vertical space, and display the tuner information across the whole bottom of the screen above the colour buttons. If you used all of the horizontal space available, then you can fit all of that information into a single "row" rather than stacking it as shown. It would also be more clear that the tuner information is not relevant to the currently highlighted service.

This sounds like an interesting option to explore. I will make the change when I finish coding up Prl's suggestion.

Regards,
Ian.

[IanSav]

Hi Prl,

Here is my understanding of your suggestion.

OverlayHD version 0.82 FAV proposal 2...

Thoughts?

I will now code up MrQuade's suggestion for comment.

Regards,
Ian.

[MrQuade]

I will now code up MrQuade's suggestion for comment.

I was thinking something like this as a rough idea:

Tuner Info Bottom.png (122.77 KiB) Viewed 3574 times

Where does the now/next information come from in the bottom of the right pane? Is that from the EPG, or from the now/next on the current service. Similar thoughts apply.

[prl]

...
Where does the now/next information come from in the bottom of the right pane? Is that from the EPG, or from the now/next on the current service. ...

It looks like they all (now/next/later) come from an EPG search.

[prl]

Hi Prl,

Here is my understanding of your suggestion.

Thoughts?
...

If the tuner information is to stay in the screen, down the bottom of the pane like that that would be my preference.

[IanSav]

Hi,

Here is an tweaked / improved version of the changes suggested by Prl:

OverlayHD version 0.82 FAV screen PRL proposal (tweaked)...

Here is a version of the proposal using MrQuade's: suggestions:

OverlayHD version 0.82 FAV screen MrQuade proposal...

I have been looking at the original version of this screen for so many months now that any change looks odd to me.

Perhaps a moderator can move all these OverlayHD change discussions to the OverlayHD thread and we can see how other OverlayHD users feel about these changes.

I could implement any of these options as they all have merit. They have all be coded into a skin so they all work. If a change is to win out I would go with Prl's suggestion as I can't get MrQuade's suggestion to look as balanced as I would like. (Further suggestions are welcomed.)

Regards,
Ian.

[MrQuade]

In both cases, the separation of the tuner info from the highlighted event info serves to improve the readability I think.

[prl]

+1

I'd be happy with either.

[IanSav]

Hi,

For the moment I will move forward using Prl's suggested layout. If others would prefer another option then please speak up.

This is how the FAV screen now looks:

OverlayHD version 0.82 FAV screen...

Regards,
Ian.

[MrQuade]

I just popped my cherry on the OverlayHD skin for testing on the T4 alpha.

I noticed that the OverlayHD skin does not use the "Show channel numbers in channel list and infobar" setting to determine if the channel number appears in the Infobar. I have this setting turned off, and it hides channel numbers in the Channel list, but not in the Infobar (beneath the channel logo).

[prl]

... I noticed that the OverlayHD skin does not use the "Show channel numbers in channel list and infobar" setting to determine if the channel number appears in the Infobar. I have this setting turned off, and it hides channel numbers in the Channel list, but not in the Infobar (beneath the channel logo).

That's because OverlayHD has chosen to use a Source/Converter/Render chain to permanently display the channel number in the infobar, rather than the "serviceNumber" Label widget whose visibility in the InfoBar is controlled by the "Show channel numbers in channel list and infobar" option.

[MrQuade]

That's because OverlayHD has chosen to use a Source/Converter/Render chain to permanently display the channel number in the infobar, rather than the "serviceNumber" Label widget whose visibility in the InfoBar is controlled by the "Show channel numbers in channel list and infobar" option.

Ahh ok. I vaguely recall a discussion of something along those lines when the number was removed from the default skin's Infobar. Was there an issue with not being able to reposition the other skin elements when the number was removed? Regardless of implementation, my own preference would be to not see the number if I have configured it to not show.

[IanSav]

Hi MrQuade,

I just popped my cherry on the OverlayHD skin for testing on the T4 alpha.

What do you think?

Have you tried out the associated control plugin?

I noticed that the OverlayHD skin does not use the "Show channel numbers in channel list and infobar" setting to determine if the channel number appears in the Infobar. I have this setting turned off, and it hides channel numbers in the Channel list, but not in the Infobar (beneath the channel logo).

I wasn't short on space and can't easily reposition the picon so I left the number in place. I will look at making OverlayHD follow the other skins and make the number disappear on demand. I warn you that I will be leaving the area blank if the number is not displayed.

Regards,
Ian.

[MrQuade]

What do you think?

I do like the efforts made towards overall consistency of the interface's elements. The ability to set themes is a very nice feature. I appreciate that there is only so much that can be improved within the confines of a skin as well, and have noted your efforts to get some more control incorporated into the code.

We did discuss the Channel List earlier in the thread, so I have mentioned this before, but I still feel somewhat overwhelmed by detail on that screen, and feel it could do with being less busy. Moving the signal display improve that page quite nicely. That all being said, I find the default easy-hd Channel List a bit sparse and think there might be a happy medium somewhere.

The signal level display was another interesting enhancement. My Channel 10 reception is not fantastic, and when tuned to that channel I am apparently receiving almost constant bit errors, which resulted in the signal display flashing on and off continuously. It would be handy to be able to optionally inhibit that bit-error indication.

By occupation, I work with (mostly) ASM compliant industrial HMIs, which are as a general rule, much more muted and information density is deliberately structured, so it takes some getting used to other interfaces that display lots of colour and information in one place. Which is not to say that industrial interfaces are necessarily a good model for a consumer AV device . I do think the colour controls that you have developed may allow a somewhat similar effect to be achieved though.

As a general rule, skinning limitations aside, I would say I am in favour of making contextually important information "pop", providing adequate, but not overwhelming visual hints to interactive elements (I get nervous when too many functions are hidden behind button long-presses), and ensuring that the user interaction is as consistent across the whole interface as possible. Many of these things that I notice through reading the forums, that you work towards improving.

Have you tried out the associated control plugin?

I had a quick look, but just enough to make sure nothing immediately crashed the alpha firmware.

I warn you that I will be leaving the area blank if the number is not displayed.

I know you are hamstrung somewhat by the available widgets, but is there no way to control visibility of the graphical elements without having to add extra code?

[IanSav]

Hi MrQuade,

The signal level display was another interesting enhancement. My Channel 10 reception is not fantastic, and when tuned to that channel I am apparently receiving almost constant bit errors, which resulted in the signal display flashing on and off continuously. It would be handy to be able to optionally inhibit that bit-error indication.

Given the problems that bad reception can cause on recordings I felt it important to make reception errors stand out. I have not noted any comments on the error state being so distracting. I assume that most users of OverlayHD have acceptable reception. If you feel that the error display should have a more sedate option then please tell me what you would prefer to see. I will try to add an alternate view as an option.

By occupation, I work with (mostly) ASM compliant industrial HMIs, which are as a general rule, much more muted and information density is deliberately structured, so it takes some getting used to other interfaces that display lots of colour and information in one place. Which is not to say that industrial interfaces are necessarily a good model for a consumer AV device . I do think the colour controls that you have developed may allow a somewhat similar effect to be achieved though.

As a general rule, skinning limitations aside, I would say I am in favour of making contextually important information "pop", providing adequate, but not overwhelming visual hints to interactive elements (I get nervous when too many functions are hidden behind button long-presses), and ensuring that the user interaction is as consistent across the whole interface as possible. Many of these things that I notice through reading the forums, that you work towards improving.

When you get a chance have a look at all the element colouring options available in the plugin. The UI can be made as loud or sedate as you wish. A future build will also allow for a number of user defined colours to also be used.

I warn you that I will be leaving the area blank if the number is not displayed.

I know you are hamstrung somewhat by the available widgets, but is there no way to control visibility of the graphical elements without having to add extra code?

Almost everything requires code to change visibility options. The skin mostly only allows designers to specify the location and look of items on the screen. That said, I do use a few tricks to change things around. Unfortunately the info bars are loaded at system boot and can't be changed by my techniques. (I wish they could be reloaded by programmatic command!)

I just remembered why I did not follow the LCN number display switching. I couldn't find the display variable that only provides the LCN if the LCN display is enabled. The other skins use a variable that displays the LCN and name or name only. I need an LCN alone or nothing depending on the setting.

Regards,
Ian.

[MrQuade]

Given the problems that bad reception can cause on recordings I felt it important to make reception errors stand out. I have not noted any comments on the error state being so distracting. I assume that most users of OverlayHD have acceptable reception. If you feel that the error display should have a more sedate option then please tell me what you would prefer to see. I will try to add an alternate view as an option.

Both Channel 10 and ABC show reduced SNR compared to the other channels, but only Channel 10 shows bit errors (and does so constantly). ABC and Ten are both around 220MHz, and the other channels are in the 190Mhz(ish) range, so I suspect my ancient antenna and feeders are to blame for this. The low SNR has never translated into visual or audio glitching, and my recordings are clean, though I have often thought about hiring someone to bring everything up to spec.

The bars adequately indicate that my SNR is not ideal already, so the fact that I am receiving bit errors is largely redundant information to have on such a prominent UI element. That sort of detail is useful but should be relegated to a diagnostic plugin.

[IanSav]

Hi MrQuade,

I just remembered why I did not follow the LCN number display switching. I couldn't find the display variable that only provides the LCN if the LCN display is enabled. The other skins use a variable that displays the LCN and name or name only. I need an LCN alone or nothing depending on the setting.

I found the problem and this is now working on my test machine.

I will add this to the next release.

Regards,
Ian.

[IanSav]

Hi MrQuade,

If you are still trying out OverlayHD then here is a quick patch to fix the hide channel number issue you reported...

Edit skin_infobars.xml:

• In the Screen "Infobar" delete the line

  Code: Select all

  		<widget name="serviceNumber" position="0,0" size="0,0" transparent="1" />

• In the screen "SecondInfoBar" delete the line

  Code: Select all

  		<widget name="serviceNumber" position="0,0" size="0,0" transparent="1" />

• In the screen "InfoBarCommon" replace the three lines

  Code: Select all

  		<widget source="session.CurrentService" render="Label" position="10,640" size="140,30" backgroundColor="InfoBackground" font="Regular;30" foregroundColor="InfoLCN" halign="center" transparent="1">
  			<convert type="ServiceName">ServiceNumber</convert>
  		</widget>"

  with the single line

  Code: Select all

  		<widget name="serviceNumber" position="10,640" size="140,30" backgroundColor="InfoBackground" font="Regular;30" foregroundColor="InfoLCN" halign="center" transparent="1" noWrap="1" />

Regards,
Ian.

[paullings]

Hi Ian,
A quick question please. Is the message box shown below configurable in OverlayHD. If so I can't work out what it's called.

Thanks,

[IanSav]

Hi Robert,

From memory this screen is a "MessageBox" and is defined in "skin.xml". The "MessageBox" is one of the most common screens used in Enigma2. Any changes to this screen will have widespread affects.

Regards,
Ian.

[prl]

Yes, that's the "MessageBox" screen skin. It's used very widely (~270 times in the main body of the firmware), and any skin changes that affect that popup will affect all MessageBox screens.

The MessageBox code also does resizing to adapt the size to the message box contents, so some things are harder to overide than usual in a screen skin. Changing the font, the font size or the icons should work. You may not be able to change the icon sizes, though, without them getting cropped or ending up in the wrong place.

[paullings]

Thanks for your explanations Ian and Peter.

[paullings]

Hi Ian,

Would it be possible to have the ICE TV background for the EPG screen as in the default skin for ICE TV users.

Thanks,

[IanSav]

Hi Robert,

Would it be possible to have the ICE TV background for the EPG screen as in the default skin for ICE TV users.

The design ideals behind OverlayHD are not to have loud static backgrounds behind things. That said, I assume you are simply looking for and on-screen visualisation and confirmation that you are currently using IceTV?

I will look at adding an IceTV logo to all EPG screens that are using IceTV. Will that do?

Regards,
Ian.

[prl]

I think that the IceTV branding in the official EPG skins may have been required in Beyonwiz's agreement with IceTV. Since the company that made the agreement on the IceTV side no longer exists, I'm not sure what the status of that is (if it in fact was the case). And, of course, you're not Beyonwiz, anyway.

The official skins aren't particularly consistent on this, either.

The Graphical EPG with PiG has the IceTV background image, while the Graphical EPG without PiG has a small IceTV logo in the top right and a plain transparent black background in the top bar. The Graphical EPG without PiG wouldn't show much of the IceTV background image anyway.

The MultiEPG has both the IceTV background image and an IceTV logo above the tip left of its PiG.

The single channel EPG just has the IceTV logo to the left of the screen title and a plain transparent black background.

The Infobar EPG has the "Beyonwiz button" (FTA Guide) background image and the IceTV logo in the top bar about 2/3 of the way across the screen. It also probably wouldn't show a useful amount of the IceTV background image, either

[paullings]

IanSav wrote:
I will look at adding an IceTV logo to all EPG screens that are using IceTV. Will that do?

Yes I think that would be fine. Just something visual to let you know the EPG is from ICE.

[IanSav]

Hi Robert,

Okay, I have added IceTV and FTA EPG icons to all the EPG displays.

Sample EPG view with IceTV icon.

Sample EPG view with FTA EPG icon.

Unfortunately these and the many other pending OverlayHD changes won't be available until some code I am awaiting acceptance (since about April) are integrated into the firmware.

Regards,
Ian.

[paullings]

Hi Ian,
I think that's fine. I'll just need to be patient and hope your changes will be accepted soon.
Thanks again for all your efforts.

[prl]

In 0.81, screens that use the ScreenTemplateChoiceList0 panel truncate descenders in the list items.

This can be clearly seen in the EPGExtensionsList screen (long-EPG or long-INFO from live TV). The descenders on the letters "y" and "p" are cut off in the "search EPG from history..." and "Select default EPG type" list entries.

Similarly in other uses of ScreenTemplateChoiceList0 (e.g. the extensions list, BLUE from live TV, the "p" in the "SimpleUmount" list entry).

[IanSav]

Hi Prl,

In 0.81, screens that use the ScreenTemplateChoiceList0 panel truncate descenders in the list items.

This can be clearly seen in the EPGExtensionsList screen (long-EPG or long-INFO from live TV). The descenders on the letters "y" and "p" are cut off in the "search EPG from history..." and "Select default EPG type" list entries.

Similarly in other uses of ScreenTemplateChoiceList0 (e.g. the extensions list, BLUE from live TV, the "p" in the "SimpleUmount" list entry).

I am not seeing this on my test T3 running 4.4 though it *IS* happening on the T4 running 16.1!!!

Both firmware builds are running an almost identical skin. The only difference if the VKeyIcon change required for 16.1 is enabled on one box and not on the other. This should not have any effect on font sizing. There must be something else different under the covers. Do you have any thoughts on what is going on?

Regards,
Ian.

[emmsee]

G'day Ian,
Having a problem downloading OverlayHD Skin.
I've tried 2 Laptops, a tablet and my Android phone and even went to a neighbours thinking my internet may have been the problem.
All start the download and stop after about 600kb with 'failed' as the result.
I do tick the I am not a robot box before starting download.
I've tried left clicking as well as right clicking and save as.....both fail.
Any other repository or can you email it to me?
cheers
Mike

[IanSav]

Hi Mike,

The download link is working for me when I test it:
https://bitbucket.org/IanSav/overlayhd/ ... 81_all.ipk

Unfortunately I am having issues moving the skin forward and remaining compatible with the shipping Beyonwiz firmware builds. I submitted changes to the Beyonwiz firmware in April last year that would allow me to enhance the features of OverlayHD. Those changes are still waiting to be accepted and merged. In the interim OverlayHD has moved on. Last night I submitted a cut down patch in a last-ditch effort to allow me to productively move forward with the new OverlayHD skin on the Beyonwiz. This pull request is also awaiting consideration. I am waiting to see what happens now.

Regards,
Ian.

[prl]

I've noticed that in the current version of OverlayHD in the repository, the "list" widget in MovieSelection (skin_filemanagers.xml), all the attributes dateWidth, dateWidthScale, lenWidth, lenWidthScale, sizeWidth and sizeWidthScale are given values.

That's not how they are intended to be used. If set, dateWidth (in pixels) overrides dateWidthScale (in font height units), and makes the use of dateWidthScale redundant (and similarly for the other attributes). In a screen with user-adjustable fonts like MovieSelection, IMO the best results will be had by only using the font-size proportional widths, because the fields will adapt to the font size (at he cost of reducing the space available for the item name text.

[IanSav]

Hi Prl,

OverlayHD is undergoing a major overhaul. Not all the latest updates, changes and corrections are in the repository yet.

I am alternating between updating OverlayHD, refining the date / time code and other coding duties for OpenViX. Unfortunately there are only so many hours in the day. Hopefully I can get an OverlayHD update ready soon.

Regards,
Ian.

[prl]

No problem. I was checking something else when I noticed it, so I thought I should flag it to you.

[dRdoS7]

Hi,

Is OverlayHD going to be added as downloadable Plugin or, preferably, as one installed with a USB FW update one day (soon)?

Thanks,

drdoS7

[IanSav]

Hi dRdoS7,

Is OverlayHD going to be added as downloadable Plugin or, preferably, as one installed with a USB FW update one day (soon)?

The distribution mechanism is not up to me.

OverlayHD will soon also be available via the OpenViX feeds but that won't help Beyonwiz users.

Regards,
Ian.

[000]

Hi folks.

Just wondering for the 1st page of this thread, should the download URL for OverlayHD be changed
from: https://www.bitbucket.org/IanSav/overlayhd/downloads
to: https://bitbucket.org/IanSav/overlayhd/downloads/ ?

Cheers =>

[prl]

It certainly looks like it should be changed.

[IanSav]

Hi 000,

Just wondering for the 1st page of this thread, should the download URL for OverlayHD be changed
from: https://www.bitbucket.org/IanSav/overlayhd/downloads
to: https://bitbucket.org/IanSav/overlayhd/downloads/ ?

Thanks for the alert. It looks like things at BitBucket have changed. Link updated.

Regards,
Ian.

[IanSav]

Hi,

I am preparing the next version of OverlayHD and would like to know if there are any users who would like to help me by testing out the new version. I am looking for a couple of people to really put the skin and plugin through the wringer looking for issues. I want to know about any and all screens that don't look like OverlayHD or have any issues at all. I am also interested to ensure that the plugin works correctly and reliably.

This new version has undergone substantial under the cover changes. There are also a number of new features. The changes include dual operation under both Beyonwiz and OpenViX firmware. New features include icons for ratings, full compatibility with the new date / time system, the ability to hide the colour buttons not activated by the code, addition of the EPG NOW highlighting and remove the analogue clock option (as the underlying code appears to have been removed).

It is important that Beyonwiz users don't see the OpenViX features and vice versa. (I already have testers for OpenViX.) The new version will require the current beta version of Beyonwiz firmware or anything newer.

Depending on the results of the testing a new release may be imminent.

Regards,
Ian.

[Paul_oz53]

Happy to be involved !

T3 and T4 both running 0.81 RC 5.

Paul

[IanSav]

Hi Paul,

Happy to be involved !

T3 and T4 both running 0.81 RC 5.

Why aren't you running the production 0.81?

By the way, the new version will be version 1.60. The skin and the plugin will now share the same version number. (0.81 was the skin version number while the plugin version was 1.54.)

Regards,
Ian.

[dRdoS7]

Hi,

I have one suggestion/request: I find the colour selection is very tedious, as it's only possible to use the up/down buttons (AFAIK). Is there a way to use, ch+/- or next/prev, to speed it up a bit? Initial set up takes a while, especially if there's a few to change, or find the special colour we want.

Second suggestions/request : is the message about restarting GUI really necessary if only a colour is changed? I ask this because when I change colours, I ignore that message, and the new colour is activated regardless.

Thanks,

dRdoS7

[Paul_oz53]

Hi Paul,

Happy to be involved !

T3 and T4 both running 0.81 RC 5.

Why aren't you running the production 0.81?

By the way, the new version will be version 1.60. The skin and the plugin will now share the same version number. (0.81 was the skin version number while the plugin version was 1.54.)

Regards,
Ian.

One word - laziness!

Actually, holding back for the next iteration, which as we know has been delayed by the circuitous route necessary to get underlying changes made.
P.

[IanSav]

Hi dRdoS7,

I have one suggestion/request: I find the colour selection is very tedious, as it's only possible to use the up/down buttons (AFAIK). Is there a way to use, ch+/- or next/prev, to speed it up a bit? Initial set up takes a while, especially if there's a few to change, or find the special colour we want.

I have tried to make this faster but the delays are in the lower level code. Do you use the colour chart to select your colour options before using the UI? I have optimised the plugin a little more but performance is still not as fast as I would prefer.

Second suggestions/request : is the message about restarting GUI really necessary if only a colour is changed? I ask this because when I change colours, I ignore that message, and the new colour is activated regardless.

Some items can be changed in real time but some can't. The screens that are preloaded at boot time don't get the new settings. Rather than field complaints that the settings didn't work I suggest the GUI restart.

Regards,
Ian.

[IanSav]

Hi Paul,

Actually, holding back for the next iteration, which as we know has been delayed by the circuitous route necessary to get underlying changes made.

Tell me about it. I have been wanted to get an update out for about 10 months.

Regards,
Ian.

[dRdoS7]

Hi,

Do you use the colour chart to select your colour options before using the UI?

Forgot about the colour chart. I'll print it out, use it once, then misplace it.

Some items can be changed in real time but some can't. The screens that are preloaded at boot time don't get the new settings. Rather than field complaints that the settings didn't work I suggest the GUI restart.

OK. Any chance of a "Disable GUI Restart prompt" option? Maybe with a big hammer that operates if people enable it, and then complain about settings not activating.

Thanks,

dRdoS7.

[IanSav]

Hi dRdoS7,

OK. Any chance of a "Disable GUI Restart prompt" option? Maybe with a big hammer that operates if people enable it, and then complain about settings not activating.

Why? No need for added complication, just say no to the restart prompt.

Regards,
Ian.